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Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111631
03/30/24 11:16 PM
03/30/24 11:16 PM
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Posts: 10,518
MN
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Steven 49er Offline
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Steven 49er  Offline
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MN
It's a travesty what happened to the deer in the forested areas. I trapped beaver, marten and hunted partridge hard for three months in different forested areas of this state this year and see more deer around here in one day than I did all that time. Deer camps are becoming abandoned and a lot of family heritage lost.


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Steven 49er] #8111632
03/30/24 11:17 PM
03/30/24 11:17 PM
Joined: Jan 2015
Posts: 268
N MN
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DHH Offline
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N MN
Originally Posted by Steven 49er
Of course not Dean, we have lost a tremendous amount of habitat and loosing more every day.

Thank goodness for the deer hunters or there wouldn't be a tree left around home.

Agreed


I'd Rather Try And Fail Then Not Try And Succeed
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111634
03/30/24 11:21 PM
03/30/24 11:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 63,250
Minnesota
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Minnesota
Originally Posted by Oakey
Minnesota moose have declined from 16,000 to between 3,000 and 3,500. They say they are stable at that number but here’s the thing. Our wolves are small compared to the western wolves and avoid attacking full grown moose. Why ? Because they get killed by them. A friend of mine told about his friend who found a wolf killed cow moose and said the battlefield was huge but what stunned him was the 8 dead wolves killed by that cow. Now moose can live up to 15 years so if those remaining 3,000 moose all full grown are staying stable because of the difficulty wolves have killing them what happens when they age out and die. I predict a soon coming drastic fall from that 3,000 some number. The so called experts who are idiots in my opinion state global warming and brain worm and everything but wolves as reason for decline. Well there are healthy moose populations in numerous states far warmer than Minnesota so that’s just stupid and brain worm was present in the 70’s when I lived near Viking Minnesota and moose were everywhere. They would find one dead from brainworm from time to time but they stayed healthy for the most part. There were way more deer there then than now. The calves are being slaughtered every year mostly by wolves. Wolves are the sole reason Minnesota moose are disappearing period and anyone with a non liberal brain that lives in this wolf infested country knows it and it’s a tragedy.

100% agree


NRA and NTA Life Member
www.BackroadsRevised@etsy.com




Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111635
03/30/24 11:27 PM
03/30/24 11:27 PM
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Posts: 10,518
MN
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Steven 49er Offline
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Steven 49er  Offline
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MN
Ironically the first modern moose season that was held in MN was 1971.

I wonder why there wasn't one before that?


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Steven 49er] #8111640
03/30/24 11:42 PM
03/30/24 11:42 PM
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Posts: 132
Wisconsin
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Oakey Offline OP
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Wisconsin
Not sure why not before 1971. that I’ve read books about Alaska big game populations exploding after the wolves had wiped them out and then starved or moved after which the game came bounding back. The book The Alaska Wolf man Jack Glazer is a great read and explains a lot about the teeter totter effect when man dosnt properly manage wildlife.

Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111645
03/30/24 11:52 PM
03/30/24 11:52 PM
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Posts: 132
Wisconsin
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Oakey Offline OP
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Wisconsin
My mistake, it was 1972 when I first bow hunted. Just looked at old newspaper I saved from the Warren Sheaf. My youngest brother age 13 shot a nice buck his first 45 minutes of bow hunting with an recurve he paid $5 for. and it was big story in the paper. Bow hunting was rare then and when at the newspaper with the buck a guy stopped and said where the deer come from and we told him Peter shot it and he said it’s not deer season !!! We had just moved to Warren the January before and he thought we were nuts. Then we told him no! Not with a rifle with a bow. It was 7 years later Before I got my first bow kill

Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111646
03/31/24 12:00 AM
03/31/24 12:00 AM
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Posts: 10,518
MN
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Steven 49er Offline
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MN
I was still in diapers in 1971 but my guess is there wasn't enough moose for a season before then.

An old boy who has now passed said when he moved here from ND after the dust bowl days said there were few to no moose when he arrived and eventually they became a nuisance. I'm only speaking of the edge of the red river valley.


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111647
03/31/24 12:08 AM
03/31/24 12:08 AM
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WI
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If you have even 3000 moose and each one is able to kill 8 wolves, you won’t have a problem anymore.

Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111662
03/31/24 02:38 AM
03/31/24 02:38 AM
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,921
ohio
Ohio Wolverine Offline
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ohio
I read an article about moose and wolves on Isle Royale Michigan.
Seems there were too many moose , so they brought in wolves to thin them out.
Well it worked for a long time, except there wasn't new wolves to breed with in the packs.
Interbreeding caused the wolves to die out.
There were only 2 wolves left as I remember. The moose became over populated again.
My question is why wolves? There was a reason the early settlers killed off the wolves.
JMHO Why wolves, when each state could make millions if not billions in revenue off hunting licenses, and processing, and places for hunters to stay, along with food being bought.
Some bleeding hearts decided that wolves are great for the environment , and got other bleeding hearts to believe the same.
The same type of people that believed coyotes were cute and needed a place to live too.
Funny the country folks soon learned that their pets were now gone.
City people never noticed , and have no idea what happens outside their concrete world.
Yet they support more wolves , more laws on hunting and trapping.
It's the same with most things today. They have no idea about anything but their tiny little world!


We have met the enemy and the enemy is us!
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111739
03/31/24 08:05 AM
03/31/24 08:05 AM
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Lake Mille Lacs , MN
2poor Offline
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Lake Mille Lacs , MN
In a recent MN study 7 out of 10 moose calves born died to predation. I believe it acknowledged 70 % of that predation was wolves .

I have found 2 Moose kill sites where the moose was drug down on the Lake County road. 50’ circle of blood & bones. Not a dead wolf to be seen !

Not managing the Wolf population is the largest contributor to the decline of the once healthy MN moose population in NE MN.


It’s a lazy man who can’t find his wife a second job !
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111748
03/31/24 08:20 AM
03/31/24 08:20 AM
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South Dakota
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Rat Masterson Offline
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Family owns 80 acres up north and when trapping up there twice in a half a dozen years had a wolf come and grab a beaver carcass in broad daylight. Also the deer are pretty much gone in our area.

Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111784
03/31/24 09:32 AM
03/31/24 09:32 AM
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east central Minnesota
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Maddog47 Offline
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east central Minnesota
Any way you look at the MN DNR will say you are wrong.


Peace is that brief glorious moment when everybody stands around reloading
Thomas Jefferson
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Maddog47] #8111798
03/31/24 09:57 AM
03/31/24 09:57 AM
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Minnesota
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Originally Posted by Maddog47
Any way you look at the MN DNR will say you are wrong.

So True


NRA and NTA Life Member
www.BackroadsRevised@etsy.com




Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Steven 49er] #8111803
03/31/24 10:03 AM
03/31/24 10:03 AM
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Central MN, sort of old
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Originally Posted by Steven 49er
I was still in diapers in 1971 but my guess is there wasn't enough moose for a season before then.



I can attest to the fact that there were plenty of moose in the Thief Lake/Agassiz area well before 1971 as I deer hunted and duck/goose hunted up there since the late 1950's. Some friends and I bought property up there and built a camp in 1971 and moose were plentiful up to and well beyond that time. I recall seeing 10 in one day while deer hunting. The deer pop[ulations during that time were also high up there. I believe multiple factors contributed to the decline up there even though the wolf population has increased. Now it is rare to even see a moose track. I no longer hunt up there.


I'm just happy to be here! Today I'm as young as I'll ever be and and older than I've ever been before!
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111816
03/31/24 10:35 AM
03/31/24 10:35 AM
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minnesota
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gman Offline
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minnesota
Deer season in MN was canceled in 1971


Rifle deer was closed in 1971. Archery deer was open.

Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111835
03/31/24 11:15 AM
03/31/24 11:15 AM
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Armpit, ak
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Dirt Offline
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Interesting subject. Having come off another snow related huge decline in our moose population, I wonder if the above average snow in the 70’s may have also contributed to the decline?


Who is John Galt?
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111888
03/31/24 12:59 PM
03/31/24 12:59 PM
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MN
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Steven 49er Offline
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MN
Dirt, we had a lot of moose into the 90s maybe even early 2000s here in western MN. I don' remember the exact year when we started to loose them here. I do remember it was nothing to drive around in he evening and see a few to several, now I see one about every 3 or 4 years around home. I saw two this year in the forest north of me. Fall of 23 there was tracks of one on a property by home I hunt deer on.

I'm only commenting about the area I live, one would have a hard time convincing me that wolves were to blame here for our complete loss of wolves. We just didn't have that many IMHO, yes there were some but exponentially more now.

I would wager that the wolves are making it very difficult for them and deer to come back.


"Inflation is always and everywhere a monetary phenomenon". Milton Friedman.
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111897
03/31/24 01:28 PM
03/31/24 01:28 PM
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Manitoba
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Manitoba
There was a write up in a turn of the century hunting magazine of moose hunting getting off the train around Caribou Minn 1910??? that's the one that passes by trapper les yard later
and they were still shooting woodland caribou there at the time

Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Oakey] #8111958
03/31/24 04:27 PM
03/31/24 04:27 PM
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james bay frontierOnt.
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james bay frontierOnt.
Bush changes over time and favours different species at different times in its succession..

Last edited by Boco; 03/31/24 04:27 PM.

Forget that fear of gravity-get a little savagery in your life.
Re: My theory on Minnesota moose coming possible wipe [Re: Boco] #8112290
04/01/24 07:38 AM
04/01/24 07:38 AM
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PA
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Originally Posted by Boco
Bush changes over time and favours different species at different times in its succession..
Every wildlife management organization in the US talks about habitat ,carrying capacity, predators etc But the habitat is what controls wildlife And when it comes to habitat even if you do nothing to manage it . Time will cause it to change AND that helps certain wildlife and hinders others

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