I think the Bible is clear.... God sets up and removes kings (Presidents) for his plan.
Daniel 2:21
Daniel 4:17
Psalms 75:5-7
Jeremiah 27:5
Proverbs 21:1
So my question is, IF Biden wins the presidency, and conservative Christians continue to claim fraud and say that Trump should have won, are they resisting the will of God? (Romans 13:1-5)
Some thing I’ve been thinking about, not looking to start an argument. I’ve seen a lot of Christians both before the election and now inferring that a Trump term is what God wants for America.... but we Don’t know that, do we? If God wants Trump to win I firmly believe Trump will win, but if Biden wins I also believe that is who God wants even though we may not understand his purposes. What we want, or think is best for us, is not always in line with God‘s plan.

No.

If God will “make it happen”, why vote at all?

A guy is stranded on the ocean. After a couple days a yacht comes by and the Captain shouts for the guy to come aboard. The guy cries out, “My God will save me, please go.” Couple days later a Coast Guard ship comes by and choirs at him to climb aboard. Again the man cries out, “My God will save me, please go.” Two more days pass and a helicopter flies over, circles and intercoms to the distressed man to get in the basket. He cries out, “My God will save me, please go.” After a week on the ocean the man perished. Upon meeting God, he exclaims, “I had faith you would save me yet here I am!” God replies, “I sent a yacht, the Coast Guard and a helicopter, I figured you wanted to be here.”

Hobbie... I believe we need to vote based on our beliefs and continued constitutional rights.... I never meant to infer we should not participate in elections.

Well I hope God's will is with Texas and the Sept court

Pafoxman, good question for sure.
So you ask, "IF Biden wins the presidency, and conservative Christians continue to claim fraud and say that Trump should have won, are they resisting the will of God? (Romans 13:1-5).

First, I don't hold your view of what Paul is writing to the Romans. I hold the view that the Bible is God's story of Himself so that we may know, and not a book of what we need to do (legalism). The church has had a million sermons and parishioners have heard a million applications of what to do with Scripture and I have a sincere question about the million sermons and millions applications.

After all that.... do people know the Bible story, from Genesis to Revelation? That's a legitimate question since it is the entire canonical Bible that we have handed to us through the millennia.

Do we know the entire story of the Bible? Not just certain verses we prefer. Who God is? Why God made us? What God's plan is?
For instance, most know John 3:16. What is John 3:15? John 3:17? Are these important too?

You see, I'd offer if we ourselves, don't know that story, we (including pastors and preachers and priests) can interpret the Bible any way we want because we put "me, us, them" in every sentence and steer the verse to our interpretation.

But..... what if we read the Bible, cover to cover, like we do any other book? So that we learn the whole story.
Pulling Paul's words from one passage doesn't help us realize that the Romans were a repressed people and the thought of any other ruler was beyond the mind.
So Paul is telling them to know their God (Christ) is the one true authority and to answer only to Christ Jesus.

Many Bible teachers don't see it that way perhaps, because they themselves don't know the story, so they lose context, because the Genesis 3:15: "Seed of the woman" theme is in every single book that precedes it.

Geneses 3:15 is the entire thread and theme of redemption in all of the Old and New Scripture. Do many Christians hear that now-a-days? If not, why not?

That's my view of Scripture, which helps scrub the Presbyterian, the Lutheran, the Calvinism, the Jesus only, the Pentecostals, and on and on out of Scripture about "us"...... and puts GOD as the focal of His story.
The Bible was never meant to be a do this and don't do that "my (little m) way" to get to heaven.
Nope.

And, we have a perfect teacher in all of this! This isn't my view. It's biblical at every turn if we read it all, and better understand the story....
Christ came to rebuke legalism (Pharisees) before there was a OT/NT BIble. He is the Scripture and when He was standing in front of the Pharisees (Scripture - "Bible" study guys) they knew Him not! That should give us pause!!! That story about God right there! Basically Jesus is telling the Scripture study dudes of that era... if you knew the story, you'd see me standing in front of me instead of conspiring against me, so that you can get back to your legalism and devout memorizing of Scripture verses.
I AM the Way, the Truth, and the Life.
They didn't get it. Legalists never do because "they" are the righteous in a legalistic hierarchy and they decide. They like that.
It poisons our faith however.

So, when Paul says submit to authority, is Paul saying "government" like the NKJ linguists inserted as a page holder? I say no. Remember, there was no commas and periods and paragraphs in Paul's day as he wrote it and the Greek text meaning doesn't mean earthly authority (government)..... Paul is entirely talking about submitting yourself to heavenly authority. Only.

Appreciate your question and well thought out input. This country was founded by religious people laboring for the "individual" freedom as bestowed by their Creator, who they said is the God of the Bible.

Some of us do the same. It's about the individual. It's always been about the individual. God's image bearer. Whether in the womb or on the streets.
And so we may know, Paul is writing the same. It's not about Rome. It's about the kingdom.

Blessings brother!
Mark

I see a lot of people worshiping trump not God these days

It was never about Trump.
For some of us.

Varied reasons

I wouldn't say Trump is in any way out spoken about the great society being here in earth, like the other side of the American aisle is.


Team A. says free the American individual to go do, and be, and build, and pray, <<<<<< 50 %

Team B. says that's fine; when we say, how we say, when we say. <<<<<<<< 50%

It's tough to reconcile these two teams in 2020.

[quote=Pafoxman]I think the Bible is clear.... God sets up and removes kings (Presidents) for his plan.
Daniel 2:21
Daniel 4:17
Psalms 75:5-7
Jeremiah 27:5
Proverbs 21:1
So my question is, IF Biden wins the presidency, and conservative Christians continue to claim fraud and say that Trump should have won, are they resisting the will of God? (Romans 13:1-5)
Some thing I’ve been thinking about, not looking to start an argument. I’ve seen a lot of Christians both before the election and now inferring that a Trump term is what God wants for America.... but we Don’t know that, do we? If God wants Trump to win I firmly believe Trump will win, but if Biden wins I also believe that is who God wants even though we may not understand his purposes. What we want, or think is best for us, is not always in line with God‘s plan.[/quot

You are badly misinterpreting those verses. We have a free will, God doesn't interfere in elections, why would he? This notion that God controls every little thing through his "will" is a modern notion that has made Christians apathetic. We have taken the word Sovereign and turned it into something it was never meant to be.

So its the will of "god" to put people like Idi Amin and Hitler in power? Seems like i remember people on here saying that was the work of the devil? I wish you folks would quit confusing me.

Jesus said to not cast your pearls before swine.

I don't see you casting many pearls, so that leaves me with one conclusion.

amspoker it cant be both ways. gods will when you like a king and the devils will if you dont.

All Im gonna say is this, its easy to blame God or the devil and harder to remember that just because something happens doesn't mean God or the devil did it.

Well, we do pray for you and everyone if that's ok?

It would seem you're staunchly opposed against any discussion of God, Bible, and similar as you repeatedly post on these types of threads.
Which is fine.
Just curious.
Are you the arbiter?
It'd be sorta like an ant-trapper weighing in on every trapping post.
Every one as they deem what is worthy.
And you're always asking about evil.
We can't answer 100% so please ask God these big picture questions.

We didn't invent the game.
We're just happy to be playing in it.
Like trapping

Blessings!
Mark

Hmmm...that kind of thinking would have us submitting to anything the enemy throws at us, claiming it's all God's will. I'm not saying whether God chose Biden to be our president or not, it just seems like a fatalistic mindset to think that way about everything.

Bingo!

So you putting a tree up this year Danny?

You keeping Christmas or Sol Invictus?

Maybe you don't know what the bible really says?

The idea of a Christmas tree came over 1000 years after Christmas replaced Saturnalia so that standard seems pointless to me.

I’ll put one up because I like cutting one down in my yard and I like the way they smell. Reason enough.