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Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127143
04/23/24 09:42 AM
04/23/24 09:42 AM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 12,498
South Ga - Almost Florida
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Swamp Wolf Online happy OP
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I purchased the 110 as I wanted something a little faster to shoot a little flatter.


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Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127158
04/23/24 10:56 AM
04/23/24 10:56 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
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Green County Wisconsin
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a little back history

the 300blk was developed for a military contractor , possibly blackwater or one of those types

it wasn't meant to stuff a 308 in an AR frame it was designed to make a replacement for the MP5 9mm

it got it's start in CQB close quarters battle

how to use existing training and parts to make a more reliable gas operated short rifle that is very well suppressed and effective.
if your talking entry gun these have largely taken over the world of dynamic entry.
a 8 inch barrel with a suppressor and the sub-sonic stuff gets enough to put 230gr at about 1070fps
and provides plenty of gas to operate the BCG reliably

now you have a Stanag mag fed , AR-lower , with a easy to pop on upper to go be the bump in the night and hardly even wake the neighborhood.
as a night rig IR lasers , high risers and NVG compatible red dots allow use with goggles so they can go in dark , between low flash powder and suppressors there isn't even hardly a muzzle signature.

with that history of where it comes from out of the way , how do civilians use the 300blk

it fits basically between a 30carbine and a 30-30 for power
the velocity is about 2300fps with a 110gr bullet and 1900 with a 150gr bullet
so supers in the 110-150gr range are the common thing for civilian use.
muzzle velocity SAMMI specs on 300blk are run with a 16 inch test barrel while most rifle rounds are done with a 24 inch test barrel.

the biggest hurdle has been bullet construction .308 bullets were generally made for 308win or faster rifles.
a 300blk is like a 308 at 300 yards but at the muzzle in the 300blk about 2kfps

so the bullets that do well at 2600fps don't reliably open at 1700fps 125 yards with a 300blk

generally 300blk is a inside 200 yard for sure and really more like inside 150 yard cartridge

I have shot them on targets to 420 yards in the 110gr vmax , they are falling sub sonic a few yards past that.

all my 300blk use is generally inside 120 yards mostly around 40-90

when you start realizing low recoil , lower blast , compact package , fits in a Stanag mag. your not cutting wood with the big saw so you need to employ some little saw tactics.
shot placement is more critical

more specialized bullets , they make some even better bullets than the Deer season XP but they cost more also.

I can see where the nose on a 150gr Deer season XP at >2500fps would make that bullet come apart like a vmax
everything in 300bk is your working with a tool that doesn't have excess power and your looking for it opens well enough but not too much and a bunch of that is velocity dependent.

you are starting with a compromise originally built for clearing buildings.

but it has a place in fast follow up shots , night work , places with dumb ordinances , suppressed work.

think about it if we didn't have rules to tailor guns around we wouldn't have half the cartridges out there.

180gr bullets in 308 kills deer all day long , but we have a variety of strait wall cartridges and because of the excellent availability of AR parts it makes an easy way to build a lot of things. but they have a limit to case length.

so if you understand it is like cutting the law with the string trimmer , it gets places and does things your rider won't but it isn't good for large areas.

then you find your niche

kids on deer at archery or near archery distances

busted up people with multiple back surgeries that are recoil sensitive.

night work , suppressed work

those are all niches for 300blk.


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Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127159
04/23/24 10:59 AM
04/23/24 10:59 AM
Joined: Sep 2013
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Green County Wisconsin
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Originally Posted by Swamp Wolf
Originally Posted by TreedaBlackdog
I am just examining same topic for deer though. I am strongly considering Palmetto State Armory AAC 110 grain sabre black blade. Look effective and cheap. Good ballistic tests on gel as well with about 16" penetration from both 10" and 16" barrels

I just ordered 60 rounds of these. Hard to pass up at $13/20.

They have good reviews. Says it is a Hornady V-max bullet. Pretty good ballistics...

the Vmax has great ballistics for 300blk on a target I got my best groups from them.

just pick your shot placement carefully and don't expect exit wounds if you poke them all like you are using a 22mag you will do just fine.


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127167
04/23/24 11:25 AM
04/23/24 11:25 AM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 2,180
B61-12 vicinity, MO
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I read the reviews on the 110 saber black blade and an individual said he harvested 5 deer last year with them all exiting. 3 were double lung and 2 neck - on one he found part of the jacket on inside skin before exiting. This resembles what I saw in the ballistic gel demo with penetration beyond 16-18" but some bullet fragmentation after about 8-10" but the majority of it hanging together.

Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127203
04/23/24 12:48 PM
04/23/24 12:48 PM
Joined: Apr 2009
Posts: 12,498
South Ga - Almost Florida
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I'm in the learning stages 4 sure about this caliber and the ammo.

I really like the looks and feel of this Ruger American Ranch Gen2 bolt gun. Still haven’t shot it yet.

When the 110s and my suppressor gets here.....I'm gonna shoot them (along with the Win150s and Nosler 220s).

I'm looking at most shots less than 200yds on feral hogs. In the near future, I won't have access to open ag fields to shoot hogs as the vegetation is growing up (all ag fields on my lease have been planted in pines). Once the fields grow back up, then it's sitting in stands in the creek and river bottoms on feeders for the hogs. Some in the daytime...most at night. Shot 50yds or less. Need to be quiet as possible.....so the 220gr will come more into play then.

I will likely use the .300 AAC for predators soon. This is another reason for the faster round. There may be several 150 to 200 yds shots (suppressed) on coyotes. This winter, there will be bobcats, too. Hoping the .300 AAC with 110s don't result in too much sewing on the bcats.

I doubt I'll ever use the .300 AAC for deer. I have a Rem Model 7 in 7mm-08 for that.....that shoots incredibly well.


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Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127228
04/23/24 02:10 PM
04/23/24 02:10 PM
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Green County Wisconsin
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the 110gr vmax make a mess of a possum at 5 yards but they are kind of thin skinned.
can't say on Bobcats or coyotes but they are a little bigger I expect those to go in and seldom come out
accuracy wise 200 is not a hard shot with the vmax

I sighted in 1.5 inches high at 100 yards and 150 was zero , 200 I needed 1.5moa up elevation which was my first hash mark in my scope.
basically 0-175 was a point and shoot , if I knew it was 200 aim 3 inches high 1.5moa and it was right there.

the 150s have a .392bc I get a average velocity of 1919
sight in 1.5 inches high at 100 yards

that makes it in an AR with a higher sight about 3/4 low at 25 , 3/4 high at 50 , 1 1/2 high at 100 , 3/4 low at 150
that makes for a usable 0-150 load that if you aim a little high could carry you to 200 but would to aim up a bit
3 inches at 175 and 6inches at 200 yards. as you can see they really start to loose steam past 150


America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127319
04/23/24 05:12 PM
04/23/24 05:12 PM
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here is a video , this seems to track with what I saw in the deer

decent cavitation and yaw about 4-13 inches and then a bullet traveling base first till it stops 25-30 inches

given that you start about 800-900fps below 308win you just don't have the energy to give up to huge expansion , so some expansion , cavitation , yaw and ride through for a potential exit seems like the goal in a 300blk bullet.

he also points out seeing much more expansion in most deer season XP I haven't tried any other , soft points work fine for me in 308 and 30-06 there I run 180 and 165 gr BTSP speer bullets and deer tip over fine.
but that might be what some other commenters have noticed with XP not making exit wounds in some calibers.



Last edited by GREENCOUNTYPETE; 04/23/24 05:13 PM.

America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
Re: GreenCountyPete: Ammo Question? [Re: Swamp Wolf] #8127724
04/24/24 12:06 PM
04/24/24 12:06 PM
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Green County Wisconsin
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Same guy same rifle Winchester defense silver tip
these had all the same BC , velocity info on the box
they sure look very similar in gel also





America only has one issue, we have a Responsibility crisis and everything else stems from it.
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