Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: Posco]
#8053103
01/17/24 11:14 PM
01/17/24 11:14 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 672 N. Dakota
1lessdog
OP
trapper
|
OP
trapper
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 672
N. Dakota
|
It looks like a pretty clean install. They should have you on your way in a matter of minutes. They isolated the circulator well. Can they push water away from the boiler and expansion and bleeder tank.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053115
01/17/24 11:37 PM
01/17/24 11:37 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,298 Maine, Aroostook
Posco
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,298
Maine, Aroostook
|
It looks like a pretty clean install. They should have you on your way in a matter of minutes. They isolated the circulator well. Can they push water away from the boiler and expansion and bleeder tank. Sure.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053125
01/17/24 11:58 PM
01/17/24 11:58 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,298 Maine, Aroostook
Posco
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,298
Maine, Aroostook
|
Easy enough to reverse the circulator. They will push the water into the return lines. How will that work? I open just about all the bleeder valves on the registers. There was no air. Don't sweat it. Those small vents are designed to remove residual air (small amounts) in the system. I would imagine your plumber will purge the system after he reverses the circulator. It's a very straightforward process you can do yourself once you've been shown how.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: Posco]
#8053220
01/18/24 08:06 AM
01/18/24 08:06 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 242 PA
Snyde901
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 242
PA
|
Will they turn the pump or just rewire it? Turn it 180 degrees. Not that simple, those zone valves are also directional as are some air scoops. They are going to have to reverse piping assuming the zv's are on return where they should be. Still curious as to what that unit is hanging to the left of the boiler.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053249
01/18/24 08:42 AM
01/18/24 08:42 AM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 242 PA
Snyde901
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 242
PA
|
Correct they can go on supply or return but return is preferred for ZV's, those Honeywell ZV's absolutely impede flow if installed in the wrong direction. I looked up the piping diagram for that boiler, it shows return connection is on the right side so according to OP the pump is correct, maybe they installed the SS primary header backwards? Seems that unit to the left is a hydronic air handler
Last edited by Snyde901; 01/18/24 08:44 AM.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053450
01/18/24 12:02 PM
01/18/24 12:02 PM
|
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,298 Maine, Aroostook
Posco
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 11,298
Maine, Aroostook
|
That is the Electric 30KW boiler. They took unhooked it now it doesn't work. I asked the boss man yesterday when they were going to fix it. He asked why it was taken apart. I don't know. Any progress?
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053472
01/18/24 12:28 PM
01/18/24 12:28 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 2,365 Interior Alaska
Oh Snap
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Feb 2021
Posts: 2,365
Interior Alaska
|
What are your temperatures there today?
I love the smell of burning spruce---I love the sound of a spring time goose---I love the feel of 40 below---from my trapline I will never go!
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053500
01/18/24 01:04 PM
01/18/24 01:04 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,233 Missouri
HayDay
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,233
Missouri
|
About 20 years ago, I took over what amounted to building superintendent duties on a 3 story residential structure. Original part was about 100 years old and was heated by live steam. About 50 years prior, an addition was put on and it was heated by hot water radiant heat.........using live steam thru a heat exchanger to heat the water. The commercial furnace guy met me one day to go over the entire system. How it was designed......how it worked. My first impression was it was only slightly more complicated than a nuclear submarine.......but over time, came to realize the brilliance of the system. A mechanical marvel designed and built 50 to 100 years ago by some truly genius minds. Heating guy referred to them as "the ancients".
Fast forward 10 years, in sections where the hot water radiant heat system pipes passed thru......the two upper floors.......got gutted and remodeled one summer. We get into late fall and the heat comes on........yet no heat on the two upper floors. Talked to commercial contractor what did the remodel work and they assured me it was working. Went back to the commercial heating expert and we talk thru it. Long story short, after I (just me) spent two days messing with it concluded that during the remodel, they had cut and capped the circulation pipes. No more loop......only two dead ends. It took me and the commercial heating guy almost two hours to convince the general contractor, his plumbing sub contractor and two architects they had screwed the pooch. Their understanding........and even ability to understand it......was abysmal. It took them nearly 2 weeks and tens of thousands of $ to come back to rip out the finish so they could fix it. Somebody's E & O took a big hit.
My takeaway was if these systems are designed and installed right, they both simple and highly effective way to heat some space. If not, they can be a nightmare to deal with.
My other takeaway was even 20 year ago, the commercial boiler guy was charging about $100 per hour.......probably closer to $150 per hour or more today. If I was a young guy who had a mind for mechanical systems, there is a wide open career path for you. Buildings with these systems in place swill exist and there is a need for experts who understand how to keep them running. A forced air HVAC system is one thing. Commercial rated live steam boilers are something else entirely. Along the lines of brain surgery isn't hard if you know how. Those that know how can make a lot of money.
Last edited by HayDay; 01/18/24 01:12 PM.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053514
01/18/24 01:16 PM
01/18/24 01:16 PM
|
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,233 Missouri
HayDay
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Mar 2018
Posts: 2,233
Missouri
|
I have been on the phone with the office and tech. I think there trying to figure out what they need to do. What they need to do is show up to put eyes on what they did and what they got. They are not going to figure it out somewhere else.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053516
01/18/24 01:17 PM
01/18/24 01:17 PM
|
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 184 PA
PadCatch
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 184
PA
|
I’m currently an HVAC estimator but was an installer and service tech for many years. That boiler is obviously a condensing boiler (pvc flue piping) one thing I do know about condensing boilers is that they have an outdoor sensor (to change firing rate of boiler according to load condition of home). Was this installed? If so, was it installed where the flue exhaust is actually discharging right on the outdoor sensor? This will prevent the boiler from high firing thinking that it’s actually warmer outside than it really is. I know I saw that you had an oil boiler currently and I just find it odd that a brand new 95% condensing boiler is not handling this load. (You have very minimal heat lost through the pvc exhaust) the oil boiler probably had around 400* flue temp. Your actual boiler sizing drops whenever you installer this high efficiency equipment. That new boiler probably has around a 90* flue temp. I know I don’t like the positioning of that circulator. It appears to be on an angle which will cause that circulator to trip on thermal overload. (Its definitely going to burn that circulator up). I do believe that’s your secondary loop pump. There’s suppose to be a primary pump inside that boiler. Did the 30KW no longer being used heat the home alright? 30,000 watts X 3.4 btu = 102,000btu/hr
Disregard what I said about the circulator. I just looked at the pics and realized the photo was flopped. It is in a correct position concerning the shaft.
Last edited by PadCatch; 01/18/24 01:37 PM.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8053847
01/18/24 08:10 PM
01/18/24 08:10 PM
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 672 N. Dakota
1lessdog
OP
trapper
|
OP
trapper
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 672
N. Dakota
|
The installer never showed up today. There waiting to here back from Navian. I told the worker it's been a week since we had good heat. I talked Navian tech support and he said water should flow to the left. I told him arrow says right. He than told me sticker is on backwards. I said it it's backwards the lettering would be backwards and it's not. This weekend is a high of 6 below zero with lows of 15 below. If we don't have a bunch of electric heater on the house will freeze up.
Yes electric boiler worked good till they took it apart.
Last edited by 1lessdog; 01/18/24 08:12 PM.
|
|
|
Re: New furnace is junk.
[Re: 1lessdog]
#8054040
01/18/24 10:54 PM
01/18/24 10:54 PM
|
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 7,396 western mn
bucksnbears
trapper
|
trapper
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 7,396
western mn
|
Seems like a total disaster to me!
What happens to an easy propane furnace hooked up to simple duct work?
swampgas chili and schmidt beer makes for a deadly combo
You have to remember that 1 out of 3 Democratic Voters is just as dumb as the other two.
|
|
|
|
|