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euthanasia #8075495
02/12/24 04:43 PM
02/12/24 04:43 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 5,732
Williamsport, Pa.
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jk Offline OP
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jk  Offline OP
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Joined: Dec 2006
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Williamsport, Pa.
Dries van Agt, the Christian Democrat prime minister of the Netherlands from 1977 until 1982, has died by euthanasia, "hand in hand" together with his wife, according to the human rights organization he founded. They both were 93. The news was made public on Friday by The Rights Forum, which said the couple died Monday and and would be buried in a private ceremony in the eastern city of Nijmegen.
Former Dutch PM and his wife die 'hand in hand' by euthanasia
HAGUE: Former Dutch Prime Minister Dries van Agt, a prominent Christian Democrat who served from 1977 to 1982, has passed away at the age of 93.
According to The Rights Forum, the human rights organization he founded, van Agt and his wife chose euthanasia and passed away together.
The couple had been married for over 70 years. The news of their deaths was announced by The Rights Forum on Friday, stating that they would be privately buried in Nijmegen.
"He died hand in hand with his beloved wife Eugenie van Agt-Krekelberg, the support and anchor with whom he was together for more than 70 years and whom he always continued to refer to as my girl,'" said The Rights Forum in a statement. Sure beats the horrible months of passing of my parents in hospitals .......jk


Free people are not equal. Equal people are not free. What's supposed to be ain't always is. Hopper Hunter
Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075498
02/12/24 04:47 PM
02/12/24 04:47 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,498
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PAskinner Offline
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That's horrible. Suicide isn't right at any age. It's murder.


Right now I’m having amnesia and déjà vu at the same time. I think I’ve forgotten this before.
Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075505
02/12/24 05:06 PM
02/12/24 05:06 PM

J
J Staton
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J Staton
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It is rather strange that a Christian, if that's what a Christian democrat is, would chose suicide. Especially if in their right mind.

Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075527
02/12/24 05:43 PM
02/12/24 05:43 PM
Joined: Jun 2012
Posts: 3,835
KY.usa
rex123 Offline
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KY.usa
beats suffering and wasting away.

Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075532
02/12/24 05:54 PM
02/12/24 05:54 PM
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 3,872
meadowview, Virginia
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EdP Offline
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Joined: Mar 2012
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meadowview, Virginia
Just maybe it beats dying from the grief of losing the person you have shared your life with for over 70 years.

Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075538
02/12/24 05:59 PM
02/12/24 05:59 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,670
Georgia
warrior Online content
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warrior  Online Content
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,670
Georgia
Evil


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Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075542
02/12/24 06:07 PM
02/12/24 06:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,778
Beatrice, NE
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loosegoose Offline
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Beatrice, NE
How awful for him to choose to die in peace on his own terms. He should have wasted away and suffered in agony like a real man.

For those that believe suicide is wrong or evil....is it wrong, if, for example, a person who receives a cancer diagnosis refuses to take treatment, knowing that doing so will cause their death? In other words is choosing not to act, an evil act of suicide?

How about someone that chooses to smoke cigarettes or eats themselves into morbid obesity....is it any better because the suicide takes longer?

Re: euthanasia [Re: PAskinner] #8075543
02/12/24 06:10 PM
02/12/24 06:10 PM
Joined: Mar 2023
Posts: 1,474
WI
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Mando Offline
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Originally Posted by PAskinner
That's horrible. Suicide isn't right at any age. It's murder.

I don't necessarily agree. I think quality of life is important to look at first.

Re: euthanasia [Re: loosegoose] #8075546
02/12/24 06:11 PM
02/12/24 06:11 PM

J
J Staton
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J Staton
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J



Originally Posted by loosegoose
How awful for him to choose to die in peace on his own terms. He should have wasted away and suffered in agony like a real man.

For those that believe suicide is wrong or evil....is it wrong, if, for example, a person who receives a cancer diagnosis refuses to take treatment, knowing that doing so will cause their death? In other words is choosing not to act, an evil act of suicide?

How about someone that chooses to smoke cigarettes or eats themselves into morbid obesity....is it any better because the suicide takes longer?

In which scenario, suicide, not taking meds, or poor lifestyle choices, is the person playing God?

Re: euthanasia [Re: ] #8075549
02/12/24 06:17 PM
02/12/24 06:17 PM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,778
Beatrice, NE
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loosegoose Offline
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Beatrice, NE
Originally Posted by J Staton
Originally Posted by loosegoose
How awful for him to choose to die in peace on his own terms. He should have wasted away and suffered in agony like a real man.

For those that believe suicide is wrong or evil....is it wrong, if, for example, a person who receives a cancer diagnosis refuses to take treatment, knowing that doing so will cause their death? In other words is choosing not to act, an evil act of suicide?

How about someone that chooses to smoke cigarettes or eats themselves into morbid obesity....is it any better because the suicide takes longer?

In which scenario, suicide, not taking meds, or poor lifestyle choices, is the person playing God?

One might say all of them. You're choosing to bring about your death in all three situations, when you have the option to choose to continue living instead. Some methods are just faster than others.

Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075550
02/12/24 06:21 PM
02/12/24 06:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 21,716
Sandhills Nebraska
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Gary Benson Offline
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Sandhills Nebraska
There's things much worse than dying.


Life ain't supposed to be easy.
Re: euthanasia [Re: rex123] #8075551
02/12/24 06:21 PM
02/12/24 06:21 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 5,240
Northern Minnesota
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Northern Minnesota
Originally Posted by rex123
beats suffering and wasting away.


Probably where the suffering really starts.

Re: euthanasia [Re: loosegoose] #8075552
02/12/24 06:22 PM
02/12/24 06:22 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,670
Georgia
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Georgia
Originally Posted by loosegoose
How awful for him to choose to die in peace on his own terms. He should have wasted away and suffered in agony like a real man.

For those that believe suicide is wrong or evil....is it wrong, if, for example, a person who receives a cancer diagnosis refuses to take treatment, knowing that doing so will cause their death? In other words is choosing not to act, an evil act of suicide?

How about someone that chooses to smoke cigarettes or eats themselves into morbid obesity....is it any better because the suicide takes longer?


How about I, your children, your ex wife, your Dr Mengele, your government make that choice for you?

We ain't talking some despondent head case taking a long walk off a short pier. We're talking state sanctioned taking of human life.

Yeah, that slippery slope thingy that always ends badly.


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Re: euthanasia [Re: warrior] #8075554
02/12/24 06:27 PM
02/12/24 06:27 PM
Joined: Jun 2018
Posts: 4,778
Beatrice, NE
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loosegoose Offline
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Beatrice, NE
Originally Posted by warrior
Originally Posted by loosegoose
How awful for him to choose to die in peace on his own terms. He should have wasted away and suffered in agony like a real man.

For those that believe suicide is wrong or evil....is it wrong, if, for example, a person who receives a cancer diagnosis refuses to take treatment, knowing that doing so will cause their death? In other words is choosing not to act, an evil act of suicide?

How about someone that chooses to smoke cigarettes or eats themselves into morbid obesity....is it any better because the suicide takes longer?


How about I, your children, your ex wife, your Dr Mengele, your government make that choice for you?

We ain't talking some despondent head case taking a long walk off a short pier. We're talking state sanctioned taking of human life.

Yeah, that slippery slope thingy that always ends badly.

That's quite a leap. Nowhere did I say anything about government or anyone else making that choice for someone else.

In any case, you're creating a strawman argument. You're complaining about government forcing or encouraging people to commit suicide, instead of addressing what I actually said.

Re: euthanasia [Re: ] #8075556
02/12/24 06:32 PM
02/12/24 06:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 9,244
Alaska and Washington State
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waggler Offline
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Alaska and Washington State
Originally Posted by J Staton
It is rather strange that a Christian, if that's what a Christian democrat is, would chose suicide. Especially if in their right mind.

That's called a "CINO".


"My life is better than your vacation"
Re: euthanasia [Re: waggler] #8075564
02/12/24 06:40 PM
02/12/24 06:40 PM

J
J Staton
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J Staton
Unregistered
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Originally Posted by waggler
Originally Posted by J Staton
It is rather strange that a Christian, if that's what a Christian democrat is, would chose suicide. Especially if in their right mind.

That's called a "CINO".

Lol.

Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075567
02/12/24 06:42 PM
02/12/24 06:42 PM

J
J Staton
Unregistered
J Staton
Unregistered
J



One might say that loosegoose but if the one can't discern the difference between the three, that's one you don't go to for life questions.

Re: euthanasia [Re: loosegoose] #8075575
02/12/24 06:49 PM
02/12/24 06:49 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,498
PA
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PAskinner Offline
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Originally Posted by loosegoose
[quote=warrior][quote=loosegoose]How awful for him to choose to die in peace on his own terms. He should have wasted away and suffered in agony like a real man.

For those that believe suicide is wrong or evil....is it wrong, if, for example, a person who receives a cancer diagnosis refuses to take treatment, knowing that doing so will cause their death? In other words is choosing not to act, an evil act of suicide?

How about someone that chooses to smoke cigarettes or eats themselves into morbid obesity....is it any better because the suicide takes longer?


How about I, your children, your ex wife, your Dr Mengele, your government make that choice for you?

We ain't talking some despondent head case taking a long walk off a short pier. We're talking state sanctioned taking of human life.

Yeah, that slippery slope thingy that always ends badly.
That's quite a leap. Nowhere did I say anything about government or anyone else making that choice for someone else.

In any case, you're creating a strawman argument. You're complaining about government forcing or encouraging people to commit suicide, instead of addressing what I actually said.


They are already encouraging kids to kill themselves. Pure evil.


Right now I’m having amnesia and déjà vu at the same time. I think I’ve forgotten this before.
Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075576
02/12/24 06:50 PM
02/12/24 06:50 PM
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,670
Georgia
warrior Online content
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warrior  Online Content
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 25,670
Georgia
Originally Posted by loosegoose
Originally Posted by warrior


How about I, your children, your ex wife, your Dr Mengele, your government make that choice for you?

We ain't talking some despondent head case taking a long walk off a short pier. We're talking state sanctioned taking of human life.

Yeah, that slippery slope thingy that always ends badly.

That's quite a leap. Nowhere did I say anything about government or anyone else making that choice for someone else.

In any case, you're creating a strawman argument. You're complaining about government forcing or encouraging people to commit suicide, instead of addressing what I actually said.


Take a look north of us. Govt Healthcare first step, then MAID gets added. Nice cleaning lady acronym for Medical Assistance In Dying. Now we have multiple examples otherwise perfectly healthy people being offed by, and at the encouragement of, their govt physicians for matters as trivial as depression, unemployment or poverty. And the latest push is to open access to MAID for children.

That's not strawman, that's actually happening.


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Re: euthanasia [Re: jk] #8075580
02/12/24 06:54 PM
02/12/24 06:54 PM
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 4,498
PA
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PAskinner Offline
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And I've been there, where I was at least close to wanting to die. Thank God for good medical people but mostly thank God I know life is a gift from him and not my choice to make.

I had cancer. Already been through all the big questions. But deciding not to be treated would not have been the same as putting a bullet in my brain. Anyone who is honest can see the difference.


Right now I’m having amnesia and déjà vu at the same time. I think I’ve forgotten this before.
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