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#437917 - 11/30/07 04:48 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: Mira Trapper]
Tsarevna Offline
"Gerty"

Registered: 09/23/07
Loc: Oregon
 Originally Posted By: Mira Trapper
Funny thing about the other primates. Most are insectivore and quite a few also eat meat and all have societal colonies structured on the boss man being the supreme commander often through violent measures. Many ARA say the chimps are 95% like us but the truth is that we are 100% human while they are 100% monkey despite the gene difference of five percent.


No no no, if we are gonna play their game, you gotta be technically correct. *wink* ;\)

Chimps aren't monkeys. Basically the big "family group" is that of the Primates. Primates include the "great apes," monkeys, and lemurs.

Lemurs have tails, are small, but differ from monkeys.
Monkeys are small creatures that have tails.
Apes are usually larger, lacking tails, like chimps, orangutans, gorillas.

Humans are considered great apes, with a twist: the only living hominids. The rest of the great apes are Pongidae. (Neanderthal was the last living hominid besides us, and he departed 25,000 years ago. But some people think he was just a strange looking person adapted to the cold, and not really another species.)

Anyways the moment you call a chimp a monkey, or a gorilla or orangutan a monkey, people write you off as ignorant and dismiss your argument from that moment on.
Just remember Zira from Return to the Planet of the Apes "I am NOT a monkey!" \:D
_________________________


How to Clean Skin a Beaver Video

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#437975 - 11/30/07 05:22 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: AKtrapper26]
yote_girl Offline
trapper

Registered: 03/01/07
Loc: Ohio
 Originally Posted By: Mira Trapper
The fact that you exercise free will and support the killing of animals has put you in the wrong as far as Ingrid Newkirk is concerned. You might have missed this quote by her. I assumed you might have already known about it.



i apologize...i misunderstood the content of your reply...i should not have responded that way...i understand now...thank you

 Originally Posted By: AKtrapper26
 Originally Posted By: yote_girl
It makes no sense for God to put these animals here, only to populate and for everyone to eat lettuce.


Now that, I like. \:\)


lol thanks!
_________________________
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. -Edmund Burke

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#438427 - 11/30/07 09:04 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: AKtrapper26]
suredve Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/25/06
Loc: mn
except ya eat my flesh and drink my blood, you have no life in you.
Jesus told this to a group of people i think, but i need to see what it's realy saying.

i'm trusting the Holy Spirit to show this to me.

i know theres a diffrence how he related and how me made things evident, before his death, burial, and resurection.

he used a great mediator to reveil himself to all that beleive.
_________________________
my testimony...
gal 2:19-21 ol-kjv

http://www.alighthouse.com/thelighthouse.htm



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#438578 - 11/30/07 10:23 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: AKtrapper26]
VAH20TRAP Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/17/07
Loc: VIRGINIA
Saw this first hand the other morning when I had a coyote in one of my sets. He bounced around when I pulled up, but when I walked up to him he coward down. That is why God put man over the animals and that is why he coward down. God Bless...
_________________________
Love Running the Line...

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#438783 - 12/01/07 07:06 AM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: AKtrapper26]
Mira Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/17/07
Loc: Cape Breton Island Nova Scotia
If God didn't want us to eat meat He wouldn't have made it so tasty.

Funny how God chose so many evil shepherds to Lead His people. In fact the Three Fathers of Jewish Faith get mention as Abraham Issac & Jacob . They were the chosen by God's leaders and they were shepherding sheep & goats to look at I suppose. In fact the very first genetic manipulation in human history is that of Jacob as he picked the spotted lambs from his Father-In-Laws sheep by putting the black with the white till he had control of the flock through the offspring. The Bible is filled with animal husbandry stories because God wanted us to exercise the Dominion He gave us over nature. The Vegans want us to feel shame for that God given ability so they can have their own narcissistic pursuit of Angel Nirvana devoid of any true love for God's gifts to humanity. In that exercise they hope their Nirvana will place them in a superior position to the rest of humanity without acknowledging God's real purpose is that all flesh should die so our Souls can be harvested.
_________________________

Mac Leod Motto

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#438786 - 12/01/07 07:15 AM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: yote_girl]
Mira Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/17/07
Loc: Cape Breton Island Nova Scotia
 Originally Posted By: yote_girl
 Originally Posted By: Mira Trapper
The fact that you exercise free will and support the killing of animals has put you in the wrong as far as Ingrid Newkirk is concerned. You might have missed this quote by her. I assumed you might have already known about it.



i apologize...i misunderstood the content of your reply...i should not have responded that way...i understand now...thank you

 Originally Posted By: AKtrapper26
 Originally Posted By: yote_girl
It makes no sense for God to put these animals here, only to populate and for everyone to eat lettuce.


Now that, I like. \:\)


lol thanks!



No need to apologize . I made the first mistake in assuming you already knew of Ingrid's spite for humans and her consideration of humans as a cancerous blight upon the earth. My bad. The main thing I see in a lot of ARA is that scorn for humans. They really don't like the fact that we are so populous and at the top of the food chain. They scorn our brains as tools because it gives us high powered rifles and increases our Dominion over animals and the earth in general. They have environmentalist that despise our population numbers gravitating towards the Vegan Ara ranks for the same reason. If humans were lower down the food chain they couldn't afford to be smug about our God given position.
_________________________

Mac Leod Motto

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#438791 - 12/01/07 07:27 AM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: Mira Trapper]
SalinaKSCooner Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Loc: Salina Kansas
Im not sure if someone metioned this but dont some religions (or all maybe) have lint. Where you dont eat meat for a certain amount of time. If we are not supposed to eat meat, then why would we have lint?

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#438837 - 12/01/07 08:28 AM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: SalinaKSCooner]
Mira Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/17/07
Loc: Cape Breton Island Nova Scotia
Lent is a Religious observance of denying our body in recognition of God's gifts to us. It is a purging of our Body of whatever earthly pleasure we are drawn to. I am not a Lent observer myself as I am a Presbyterian but I have great respect for the people that in their Catholic Faith offer to purge themselves in an honest attempt to prove their love for God by denying themselves of earthly pleasures like MEAT, Alcohol ,chewing gum or alas>>>>>>>> Sex. For 40 days!!!!! I think I could give up carrots for 40 days but I see no point in that for me as God already knows I know Him. Thankfully I know the Apostles/Nicene Creed offered to God in Faith are the main gate to Heaven and God through that sacrifice He made on the Cross. Here is a link that might interest you with regards to Lent.

http://www.thercg.org/articles/ttmol.html



Edited by Mira Trapper (12/01/07 10:18 AM)
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#438860 - 12/01/07 08:54 AM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: suredve]
Bigswamp Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Loc: South Carolina
 Originally Posted By: suredve
except ya eat my flesh and drink my blood, you have no life in you.
Jesus told this to a group of people i think, but i need to see what it's realy saying.

i'm trusting the Holy Spirit to show this to me.

i know theres a diffrence how he related and how me made things evident, before his death, burial, and resurection.

he used a great mediator to reveil himself to all that beleive.





John 6:48-58 AMP

48I am the Bread of Life [that gives life--the Living Bread].

49Your forefathers ate the manna in the wilderness, and [yet] they died.

50[But] this is the Bread that comes down from heaven, so that [any]one may eat of it and never die.

51I [Myself] am this Living Bread that came down from heaven. If anyone eats of this Bread, he will live forever; and also the Bread that I shall give for the life of the world is My flesh (body).

52Then the Jews angrily contended with one another, saying, How is He able to give us His flesh to eat?

53And Jesus said to them, I assure you, most solemnly I tell you, you cannot have any life in you unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink His blood [unless you appropriate His life and the saving merit of His blood].

54He who feeds on My flesh and drinks My blood has (possesses now) eternal life, and I will raise him up [from the dead] on the last day.

55For My flesh is true and genuine food, and My blood is true and genuine drink.

56He who feeds on My flesh and drinks My blood dwells continually in Me, and I [in like manner dwell continually] in him.

57Just as the living Father sent Me and I live by (through, because of) the Father, even so whoever continues to feed on Me [whoever takes Me for his food and is nourished by Me] shall [in his turn] live through and because of Me.

58This is the Bread that came down from heaven. It is not like the manna which our forefathers ate, and yet died; he who takes this Bread for his food shall live forever.

Suredve, hope this helps, previously the Jews had brought up the subject of manna in the wilderness and challenged the Lord Jesus to produce food as wonderful as that.In verse48-49 Jesus reminds them that their fathers ate manna in the wilderness and died.In other words, manna was for this life only.It did not have any power to give eternal life to those who had ate it.In verse 50, Jesus spoke of Himself "as the bread which comes down from heaven"If any one ate this bread, he would not die".This did not mean that he would not die physically, but would have eternal life in heaven.In these verses Jesus repeatedly speaks of men eating him.Obviously, the idea of that is repulsive and impossible.Some think he meant to teach that we must eat of him in the communion service.But this is not what he said.The context makes it clear that to eat of him is to believe on him.The food and drink of this world has only temporary value,to partake of him by faith receive life that last forever.A very close union exists between himself and those who are believers in him.Whoever eats his flesh and drinks his blood abides in him, and he abides in that person.Nothing could be closer or more intimate than this.When we eat literal food,we take it into our very being, and it becomes part of us.When we accept the Lord Jesus as our Redeemer, he comes into our lives to abide,and we,too,abide(continually dwell) in him.
Christ is the bread of God who gives eternal life to those that feed on him.

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#439203 - 12/01/07 12:53 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: Bigswamp]
suredve Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/25/06
Loc: mn
bigswamp,
thankyou! been through those scriptures before, but needed to be refreshed on them.

thankyou!...
_________________________
my testimony...
gal 2:19-21 ol-kjv

http://www.alighthouse.com/thelighthouse.htm



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#440983 - 12/02/07 03:07 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: suredve]
Mira Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/17/07
Loc: Cape Breton Island Nova Scotia
Great understanding of price He payed for us bigswamp. One thing that a lot of Vegan AR will claim is that the Old Testament laws were replaced by Christ. However, the missing point is that Jesus is the Old Testament. The law never changed but our hearts have been opened to receiving God through Jesus Christ. God never changed the rule that all flesh must die but He gave us Jesus so that all Souls could be saved.


Edited by Mira Trapper (12/02/07 03:09 PM)
_________________________

Mac Leod Motto

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#441223 - 12/02/07 05:55 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: Mira Trapper]
Tsarevna Offline
"Gerty"

Registered: 09/23/07
Loc: Oregon
 Originally Posted By: Mira Trapper
If humans were lower down the food chain they couldn't afford to be smug about our God given position.[/color]


That's a very good point!
If people spent a few days starving in the woods without food, attitudes change real quick about what is food and what isn't.
I was lost for 5 days and 3 (or 4?) nights in the sierras (when I was about 10.) I raised rabbits for the pet trade and bottle fed them and everything, but by the 2nd day without food I was setting snares made of vines and shoestrings.

Did you know that most furbearing animals have just enough brains in their head to tan their own hide? I don't think that's a coincidence.

(Buffalo, horse and mammoth of course don't fit into that category, but those were sought primarily for their meat anyway.)
_________________________


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#455026 - 12/10/07 09:35 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: Tsarevna]
Mira Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/17/07
Loc: Cape Breton Island Nova Scotia
Something else to consider that was not mentioned earlier. The Plagues that Moses faced with the Egyptian people. The reason for those plagues was that God was systematically destroying the gods that the Egyptians worshiped. The Egyptians had made animals into God. They paid a heavy price for that travesty against The Living God.


http://www.padfield.com/2002/egypt_1.html

"The Egyptians considered sacred the lion, the ox, the ram, the wolf, the dog, the cat, the ibis, the vulture, the falcon, the hippopotamus, the crocodile, the cobra, the dolphin, different varieties of fish, trees, and small animals including the frog, scarab, locust and other insects. In addition to these there were anthropomorphic gods; that is, men in the prime of life such as Amun, Atum, or Osiris." (John Davis, Moses and the Gods of Egypt, p. 95).


It was through a series of ten plagues that God chose to harden Pharaoh's stubborn heart (cf. Exo. 7:3, 14, 22; 8:15, 19, 32). Egypt was a polytheistic society -- they worshiped over eighty gods. The true God of heaven was not only going to reveal Himself to Israel through the plagues, He was also going to show His superiority to all of the gods of the Egyptians.

Against All The Gods Of Egypt (#2)
by David Padfield

The first article in this series to showed how the 10 plagues God sent on Egypt were directed not only against Pharaoh and his people, but also "against all of the gods of Egypt." We will now continue with the second installment.


The goddess Hathor was the symbolic mother of Pharaoh, and the king of Egypt was referred to as "the son of Hathor." In addition to the gods already mentioned, this plague would have been a direct insult to Khnum, the ram-god, and to Bast, the cat goddess of love.


For every Christian & Jew the linked article describes what God thinks of anthropomorphic gods. Wonder how He feels about Bambi & Micky ????? It would be a good read for those who wish to understand the lead up to Exodus for the Jewish people and the destruction of Egyptian gods.
_________________________

Mac Leod Motto

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#459167 - 12/12/07 09:40 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: AKtrapper26]
doc9013 Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/10/07
Loc: Franklin, W.V.
Thank God for all his blessings.Thank God for websites like this where the truth can be told, and for people like you who tell the truth.
_________________________
If you gain, you gain all. If you lose, you lose nothing. Wager then, without hesitation, that HE exists.

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#459226 - 12/12/07 10:08 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: doc9013]
BuckNE
Unregistered

Oh, heck, its easy to counter idiot vegan claims that Jesus was some kind of vegetarian simply by pointing out that he fed the multitude with bread and FISH.

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#459346 - 12/12/07 11:02 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: ]
Country Boy Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/06
Loc: Southern Missouri
I like Proverbs 12:27 The slothful man roasteth not that which he took in hunting;
_________________________

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#460647 - 12/13/07 04:42 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: ]
Mira Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/17/07
Loc: Cape Breton Island Nova Scotia
 Originally Posted By: BuckNE
Oh, heck, its easy to counter idiot vegan claims that Jesus was some kind of vegetarian simply by pointing out that he fed the multitude with bread and FISH.



He was also a Rabi of Jewish tradition and therefore would have observed the eating of the Passover Lamb. I don't think they had such a thing as Tofu Lamb Chops back then. In all seriousness I think we should strive as Christians to reflect upon these Biblical truths with those who might not know the Biblical facts are found in the Good Book.


Edited by Mira Trapper (12/13/07 04:43 PM)
_________________________

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#460759 - 12/13/07 05:24 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: Mira Trapper]
waspshooter Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/13/07
Loc: Iowa
 Originally Posted By: Mira Trapper
Lent is a Religious observance of denying our body in recognition of God's gifts to us. It is a purging of our Body of whatever earthly pleasure we are drawn to. I am not a Lent observer myself as I am a Presbyterian but I have great respect for the people that in their Catholic Faith offer to purge themselves in an honest attempt to prove their love for God by denying themselves of earthly pleasures like MEAT, Alcohol ,chewing gum or alas>>>>>>>> Sex. For 40 days!!!!! I think I could give up carrots for 40 days but I see no point in that for me as God already knows I know Him. Thankfully I know the Apostles/Nicene Creed offered to God in Faith are the main gate to Heaven and God through that sacrifice He made on the Cross. Here is a link that might interest you with regards to Lent.

http://www.thercg.org/articles/ttmol.html



Miratrapper, I'm very impressed with this thread. I was unaware of the Vegans twisting the words of the Good Book to support their twisted ideals.

I'm Catholic, and try to observe Lent to the best of my ability. During the 40 days, we are supposed to obstain from one or more of our vices or wants (we gave up candy when we were kids, many more to choose from as adults). As far as 40 days without meat, I sure hope not! On Ash Wednesday, and all Fridays during Lent, we are to obstain from meat, but are allowed seafood and dairy. Very small price to pay for all He has done for us.

Just a thought - do you suppose the whacked thinking of Vegans stems from a lack of protein and other necessary nutrients supplied by meat? Hmmmmmmmm.....

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#461257 - 12/13/07 08:44 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: waspshooter]
Bigswamp Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Loc: South Carolina
Genesis 3:21
For Adam also and for his wife the Lord God made long coats (tunics) of skins and clothed them.

As seen above “God made”tunics of skins, and taught Adam a number of things.
1.Sin required that an "innocent" animal blood sacrifice(which pointed to the ultimate sacrifice, by God, of the Lamb of God ,Christ).
2.How to skin, flesh, and tan hides for his(Adam and Eve) use as clothing.
3.How to properly make sacrifices.


Genesis 4:2-5
2And [next] she gave birth to his brother Abel. Now Abel was a keeper of sheep, but Cain was a tiller of the ground.
3And in the course of time Cain brought to the Lord an offering of the fruit of the ground.
4And Abel brought of the firstborn of his flock and of the fat portions. And the Lord had respect and regard for Abel and for his offering,(A)
5But for [a]Cain and his offering He had no respect or regard. So Cain was exceedingly angry and indignant, and he looked sad and depressed.

The children of Adam are the focus here,under God’s watchful care, they were instructed that sinful man could only approach a Holy God only on the grounds of the blood of a substitutionary sacrifice. Cain rejected this revelation and came with a bloodless offering of fruits and vegetables and displeased God.Abel believed the divine decree and offered slain animals, thus demonstrating his faith and his justification by God (Heb 11:4).He brought the firstborn of his flock, saying in affect that the Lord deserves the best. Abel’s offering points to the substitutionary death of the Lamb of God, who(by his Blood shed on the cross) takes away the sin of the world.
What the AR groups don’t understand is “Its all about the blood”
My point is a lot about the death of animals in the Word of God has nothing to do with food!

John 1:29 amp

29The next day John saw Jesus coming to him and said, Look! There is the Lamb of God, Who takes away the sin of the world.

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#461266 - 12/13/07 08:46 PM Re: The Vegan Jesus argument Theology at it's wors [Re: ]
Bigswamp Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Loc: South Carolina
 Originally Posted By: BuckNE
Oh, heck, its easy to counter idiot vegan claims that Jesus was some kind of vegetarian simply by pointing out that he fed the multitude with bread and FISH.



Buck I tried that on the first page,lol,didn't work

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