have any of you guys who trap beaver noticed a diffrence when it comes to using lure on river beaver and pond beaver?

in your experience do river and pond beaver work lure with the same intensity ?

I've never noticed a difference. I use the same lures for all my beaver trapping.

Same effectiveness unless they have been trapped before. Some beaver just don't care for beaver lure for whatever reason.

Pond,lake,river ,creek or bath tub--no difference.
Tom

I havent noticed any differece either

so all the beaver you guys have caught have worked lured sets?

I don't use lure for every set, but the majority.

No difference,maybee you should try a fake castor mound,sometimes the critters almost tell you what to do..

About 95% of the beaver I catch, are taken in castor mounds of my making.And I use lure at these sets.
Tom

I believe there is a big difference, especially between pond and river beaver, and the time of year can also have a dramatic difference as to the way a beaver responds to lure. I have also seen a great deal of difference brtween the way a female, especially one that has pups in the lodge,will respond to lure that contains castor.
I find pond beaner to be very territorial, especially the males, and even more so during spring dispersal. The reason being that they are protecting the pups and females in that colony. I believe you can catch the males at this time of year standing on the bank waiving flags behind the set. Yea that is a bit over the top, but I have had many male beaver swim up to me while I was in the water wearing chestwaders. Why, because my lure pouch is in the front of my waders, and as most beaver trappers will attest, you tend to get plenty spilled on you while working a line.I tend to have a grease spot on the front of these waders when I am running hard and smell just like my lure. It is quite common in the spring especially, to have male beaver out snuffing at me from very close range, tail slapping and all.I've shot several of these beaver on contracts and any over two years old were all males. I've had females do this also but the two that did were both juveniles, and had never given birth, nor had pups in the lodge.
I've also spent many nights on small and large river systems trapping, and most always make a set that I can view from where I am camping.If you think you have a great beaver lure, that a beaver won't smim by, don't do this as it will show you just how many beaver are swimming by your sets, especially during spring dispersal.I've also seen females with pups smell a castor based lure approach a set from a distance of ten feet or so and swim directly back to the lodge. I'm sure it was the female because I watched the male get caught in a 14 jump I had set near the dam 20 minutes before. Took 4 days to catch her as she wouldn't come back to shore after that night. Finally caught her in a snare set in the water using the sac oil of one of her pups.
Consider what a scent mound is and what it represents. It is a territorial marker, to post notice to traveling beaver that that area is being occupied. It is a warning to travelors, particularly males that they should keep going and expect a fight if the dominant male catches you on his turf. I find this especially true of pond beaver within their ponds and somewhat true of river beaver during the spring dispersal.
I have found trapping contracts in early summer, while the pups are still quite small, very tough to catch a female beaver with castor based lure. The exception to that is a female who's male has been removed or killed during spring dispersal, or was trapped out the previous fall. It is common here to find ponds, usually within a mile of a road, that the male has been trapped already during fall or spring by road trappers, as they tend to cover more ground than the female or pups. I believe an adult female that has had pups once, quite often will pair with a traveling male and still breed in early spring. I believe this to be the reason for some of the exceptionally small pups in fall and winter.
A pond beaver with a family in the lodge is very, very aggressive, and tends to run off smaller dispersing beaver during the dispersal period. As the pups get larger, and more independent,the males tend to be less aggressive and seem to make less and less scent mounds. They may visit and remark them, but not on a daily bases like in the spring. I have found pond beaver overal much more aware of what is going on in their area than even lakes where there can be several colonies living like river beaver.
I find also that river beaver tend to live in close proximity to other colonies, often sharing a feed source area, sharing feed stations, even working on the same downed trees during the summer and fall periods.However when the female is bred or has small pups in the lodge, Spring and early summer, the territorial markers are warnings to other beaver and kept marked and enforced.
The female that is bred or has pups in lodge, when she smells a scent mound with castor based lure, avoids the odor most often, because it could mean a fight and her death or injury, which could result in the loss of her pups. I believe her sole purpose in life at this time is the care of her pups. I find it nearly impossible to catch a female, with pups, on a castor based lure. After the pups get more mobile, or after she has been on her own for a period of time she seems more susceptable to castor based lure. I find this often doing contract work in early to mid summer. I rarely use castor based lure during this time period for this reason.
If the colony or pond is new and contains just the 2-2 1/2 year old pair of beaver I don't find any difference in their response to the castor based lure, until the first set of pups are born.
If you are real interested in beaver behavior,and want to know how traps and snares get knocked down, the direction of approach, and how well your blocking sticks are doing, go make a few scent mounds with your choice of lure and watch them some night. I'm betting it will be an education.

Ufda...Rally quite a response ... To bad those were the only beaver youve ever caught.....LOL..... Very nice response wish I could write so well.... Jim..

Took the words right out of my mouth Rally.....NOT

Im still wondering how many beavs Boggy has taken in bath tubs. LOL

Rally's talking mostly about late spring and summer beaver though. Not when we are usually trapping them.

Goldy,
There are more beaver taken in Mn. during the spring season than the winter. Check DNR numbers they will confirm that.

Yep I agree Rally, but weren't you talking mostly about after the pups were born in late May and June? Or did I just misunderstand you.

I reread it Rally. I see better what you are saying. It seems that any time of the year, rivers or ponds, if you are trying to catch them all, that female can give you the most problems. No Doubt.


You are also right about watching beaver work your sets. I've learned more about beaver trapping that way than any other way. VERY educational.

I mainly saying a female with pups, and even one pregnant is a different beaver than one that isn't, and will respond to castor based lures differently.
Also I have tried to catch a spring male, that I saw on the bank on two occasions in the same spot. I used a snare witha scent mound on one side of this place I saw him and a foothold on the other. I could not get him in a trap or snare. He was a two year old male and I finally snared him going up onto the spot I scared him out of for two days. He was badly chewed, from entering larger beavers territory and wanted nothing to do with anything resembling castor. I believe this is common and accounts for alot of beaver being spotted during spring dispersal. I have caught quite a few of these chewed up 2 year olds in cross over and blind snare sets. My thinking is they travel during the day to lessen the chance of being detected by the dominate males in established colonies. Just go watch a river you have put scent mounds on during a major dispersal period, a real eye opener.

I've never really thought of it that way Rally, that they would be afraid to travel at night because of dominant males. Could very well be. I know I've seen plenty of beaver in the spring out traveling in the middle of the day. I also rely on bait sets a lot, even in the spring. It seems beaver, at least where I trap, can't resist a green popple stick and a good food lure at any time.

I believe the eye appeal has more to do with the added attraction than the actual bait, especially during the day. The thermoclime(SP) is going from the land to the water in the evening hours as it gets colder, and from the water to the land as it warms in the day time. I don't believe our beaver are hungy often as here they just swam by a stand of poplar or willow a couple minutes ago. If I use bait, it is skinned up for the eye appeal on the scent mound, and is accessible from the water if I expect it to be used as bait by itself. By that I mean I put it so the beaver doesn't have to get out of the water to get it. An easy meal without the work, with no lure.

I always use a small stick of bait with a castor mound for traveling beaver. But I will use plain bait with lure on dams on established colonies. I think any time you can increase the attractiveness of your set the better off you are. Especially in the spring on travelers. Like you touched on above, you just don't know for sure how a beaver is going to react to a castor mound. I really think the bait adds a lot of attractiveness. It's been proven to me that popple, where I trap, is like candy to them. I've watched beaver on mounds, with no trap there, grab the popple and go. Many times my bait will be gone if I have a beaver in the trap, taken by another beaver. I know this, it certainly doesn't hurt, it only helps.

This thread has "water archive" written all over it...

Now, what would be great, is if the Boss could chime in...

I haven't noticed any difference down here in pond beavers vs river beaver's response to lures.... except seasonal differences. Down here, both types of beavers respond well to castor based, curiosity and food lures in Fall, Winter and Spring. During the summer months, these beavers in my area don't care for much except for the food lure.

However, when working small ponds containing a pair of beavers, I've noticed that the first beaver is lured easily to a set, but after that one is caught, the second beaver may seem to develope an allergy to lure and won't respond. I think its because both are swimming in the small pond and when one gets whacked, the other notes the smell of the lure and associates it with danger.

I especially hate to trap a pair in small man-made ponds. Those are the worse for me.

Or could it be Paul that after the one get's wacked, that the other beaver checks the lure out once and just doesn't respond to it again? Say the first beaver is dead underwater.

Paul, when a beaver in a pond like you state would it be posible then to use a bit of caster from the first beaver to attract the remaining beaver?

That's possible Goldy, and a good reason to change up lures after the first catch when dealing with only a pair in a small pond.

R Howard, yes, that has worked for me.... but usually after a week or so has passed so the remaing beaver has been missing its mate.

Thanks, I will remember that.

Rally said, and I have done this too, that a remaining dominant beaver will often react to the castor or sac oil from another beaver in the colony as well.

Paul, when you are using your Woodchipper, are you using some kind of eye appeal?

Paul,
Do your beaver have active scent mounds all year. Some beaver guys down south tell me they keep them working all year some say not.
I also believe the pond beaver here may be protecting their feed piles. They are locked under ice for 5 months and know they have to have it.The ones that don't don't pass on their genes.

I have not seen that here Rally. Scent mounds here in July have weeds growing out of them.

We have two kinds of beavers here. We have WI beavers and AL beavers. You can tell right away which you're working with. The WI beavers will have feed piles outside their dens/lodges and the AL beavers will have none.

Goldy, I love eye appeal at all sets at the bank. I don't have popple here, but instead use soft maple. I use it because when you shave off the bark, the white stays white a long time. If you try sweet gum, oak, ash or other hardwood, it turns brown in hours.

I didn't know if you had a certain bait beaver really liked, like we do with popple.

I don't care what the beavers are eating, I want something that looks appealing. A brown stick on the bank holds no appeal, but a nice white fresh looking one does. Even the pine eating beavers respond to the peeled maple stick, because it looks good.

Beavers in my area prefer sweet gum, for the most part, but some will eat pine, maple, cypress knees, ash, etc. However, that sweet gum that they prefer turns brown awfully quickly when the bark is peeled off it.

Our popple stays pretty white for a day or two, but browns eventually as well. It has an odor though, stronger than a lot of other trees they eat.

The only beaver food tree here that has a noticable odor is pine to me.

Paul,
I've got a study paper done in Ohio, that discusses beaver reaction to castor and scent mounds. Sherm Bloom sent it to me a few years ago. They found the beaver there also didn't keep the scent mounds active after about mid june.
Yea, we train those northern beaver to be ready for the worse conditions. LOL

If beaver eat pine here, it's because they have nothing left. I'd bet I can count on one hand the amount of times I've seen pine chewed on by beaver.

Goldy, ours eat pine sometimes when sweet gum is readily available. I think its those retarded Alabama beavers that do it though - lol.

I figured you were gonna tell us the Wi beaver were packing snow shoes on there back!!!

Rally, do you think they weave those snow shoe webbings from Honeysuckle vines down here?

On those small pond beaver one problem is you really do not know what happened when the first one was caught, was the other one right there or did it come while the other one was thrashing around maybe. I believe most all dead beaver get checked out by the live beaver but the water here is mostly clear which it may be alot different in murky water areas. One of the guys trapping here always used white sacks for drowning bags, after the first one is caught and found dead by his buddies next to a white sack I always thought that might put them off of any area containing white sacks which were not there before. A lot of guys seem to think all critters are just dumb animals, but my impression is they are smarter than you would think and just too curious for their own good.
I am not a big beaver trapper by any means but I try to pay attention and remember what I see.

thank you Rally for your detailed response.thanks to everyone who responded.

i have another question, do any of you think that location could effect whether or not beaver work lure? as in western vs eastern?

Jerry and i talked about this in detail a while back and seems his experience has been that the pond beaver hes came in contact with in Wyoming all but refuse to work lure.these are beaver that are so remote hes sure no one has ever even seen them let alone trapped for them.hes been trapping the are 20 yrs and has yet to see another beaver trapper or beaver trap in his trapping area in all those years. marten and other trappers yes but never a beaver trapper.so they havent been ducated by another trapper who couldnt catch them but made em smart.

could it have something to do with the castor used to make the lure? maybe they dont find it appealing? any ideas would be appreciated.

he still catches alot of beaver out there but predominantly by blindsetting ponds.

the response to lure from pond beaver out there, for him has been so bad, he doesnt even use lure except on sets made for river beaver.

other places he may run into individual beaver that wont respond to lure but never really an area where they just wont work lure.closest he came was trapping Ohio one time.

Have any of you who have trapped in Wyoming or even Montana for beaver noticed any differences or is it just, luck of the draw on the beaver youre targetting?


when we're trapping WV we havent really ran into the problem although we have ran into and educated one now and then that we had to be very creative on catching.

Thanks in advance to any who add their opinions.

I never noticed the western South Dakota (Black Hills area)beavers behaving like that Cathryn. They were just like the eastern beavers in their response to lure for me.

maybe the beaver hes trapping in Wyoming ponds are flukes? i dont know.

thanks everyone for your input.

Nah Cathryn, they probably know Jerry's reputation and are skeered - lol.

LMAO!! ill have to tell him that one, LOL

I was told once that when using lure from northern vs. southern is the food type that was the factor. If trapping in an area that carrys more aspen use lure made and taken from that environment.
I believe the "boss" mentioned that at our convention in Michigan! And we have a lot of aspen/poplar trees. And I have seen them chewing on pine,maple and oak. Just figured they were hard up for food.

No probably Iron wood, would probably wear less.LOL

I think its those retarded Alabama beavers that do it though - lol.

I saw that Paul!


Id imagine most northern trappers if they came here would think us both crazy Paul setting traps in what they would term 'dead ponds' in the middle of summer. Only sign many times is some grass clippings around the edges, nothern trappers would think it's 'rat sign, which is what it looks like. But come mid summer our's only graze around the edges, hardly ever leaving the water and never making or keeping up a castor mound.

Some are even too lazy to repair a dam for several days!

Different as night and day trapping them in the heat of summer or in the winter around here.

Rally ,by no way am i a wildlife biologist but Sherms paper about castor mounds not being used after June in ohio is probably correct, I cant say that i have noted any great amount of activity at a castor mound past April unless its been rather cold or wet.The biggest or all of our ice is gone by mid march were I'm at.To me pond beaver can be the toughest to trap, and as you, and others have said those females with kits or are going to have kits are the tough ones to catch.When trapping ponds gang setting with differnt lures and a buch of traps the first night seems to work the best , all foot traps will be on drowners and all body grips will be set so the beaver will be out of site. If i feel that there are still beaver in the pond I'll start setting snares and foottraps at blind sets. When snaring beaver i seem to get the most fur damage when im in area with a high population of beaver. Or after the ice goes out. As Paul said about N.Carolina, I get a better reaction to a food/curiosit lure here in ohio in the summer than to a castor lure.Many times during the summer I've used just a peeled willow stick stuck straight up out of the mud with a foot hold trap in front of it to catch pond or river beaver with no lure...Carl

Cathry,
Could be the beaver out in that remote area are seing some disturbance on the bank, like slicked up foot prints. Is he pounding metal stakes on the bank? Maybe the disturbance could be just driving near the pond on a ATV. Seems some bever get used to certain noise level, like a boat going by on a river, or a snowmobile trail that runs adj. to a pond. I've been cutting holes in the ice with a chainsaw and had beaver come up in the first hole while I was cutting the second, in remote areas, and had some shut down for several days from what I believed to be that same chainsaw in a different pond. I believe what we hear and they do is going to be different, like when a pond is covered in ice but no snow and one that is covered with two feet of snow on that ice. The sound transfer has to be different as the snow would deffinately muffle the sound transfer. I believe beaver, especially in remote areas are more leary of going to shore, at least here in Timber wolf country, as the threat of being eaten is real and a reality for beaver during dispersal periods.
I snare most of my beaver and find that river beaver to be more likely to stay on the bank as I approach them than pond beaver. I've had pond beaver bale into the water while I was clear across the pond while the river beaver seem to stay on the bank as I approach much closer. I'm guessing the river beaver are just used to more noise and movement, where as the pond beaver are very alert to movement on the bank and ripples in the water. By compararison, a beaver swimming in a river, has less to worry about as far as something actually confronting it, like bears, wolves, coyotes, or a lion. A beaver in a pond has to worry every time it gets close to the bank, runs up a tributary, crosses the dam, or goes ashore to cut a popple. I've seen evidence of wolves laying in wait by beaver ponds, and bears are wonderful at finding and eating beaver in traps along the ponds in the spring.
Jtrapper,
The beaver here often do the same thing. They live on cattails, both leaves and roots. They seldom come to the bank but rather sit in shallow water. The lake across from my haouse is a perfect example. There are complete rafts of cattail roots they climb up on and eat, and store large caches under the floating bog for later winter use.They often won't repair a dam either until the spring run off subsides.

Mass's of floating vegetation here like that Rally means you have nutria, lol. Our beaver basically graze along the shore line, not gathering anything up then feeding at one location, makes it real difficult to figure out exactly how many your dealing with or if you have them all when you leave a site.

Rally, the beaver he traps in Wyoming have no access other than by foot.

he walks a mile or more into the majority of the ponds hes setting and most are between 7,000 and 10000 feet. because of the distance he has to walk in he carries nothing in except the traps hes using and a feedsack ,which if he sets a drowner, he fills with rocks or whatever at the site to make his drowning weight.

Hes mostly setting crossovers and using sticks from the dam as his stakes and hes setting the channels with connibears, again using sticks as stabalizers. he intentionally tries to introduce as little as possible into the ponds so metal stakes are out for him.

he doesnt even use lure in the ponds anymore because they dont work it.

hes trapping in October and did say maybe that has somehing to do with why theyre not working the lure.But hes been trapping in wyoming for years and doesnt have luck with lure, castor or otherwise.

it has been his exprience out there that the river beaver will work lure for him but the pond beaver simply wont, and he really hasnt been able to pinpoint why.

he is able to catch the pond beaver using other methods but we're just curious as to why other trappers out there think theyre not working the lure in those ponds out west or if any other trapprs out that way have experienced this in their trapping.

it isnt hit and miss for him either the pond beaver are not responding to the lure in october across the board and never have as long as hes been out there trapping.

to qualify him as a beaver trapper i will say hes trapped beaver in 10 or so states across the cuntry so hes had alot of experience with trapping beaver in diffrent geographic locations.

Cathryn,
Maybe by the time he walks in there he has worked up such a sweat he stinks. LOL Got me, I've not trapped beaver at that elevation, and after reading your posts, I know why.LOL
Jtrapper,
They don't pile anything here in the summer either, but come Sept. and Oct. it can look like a brush hog has gone through the regrowth popple on shore. They tend to eat "green" in the early summer. I've heard it said that it has something to do with cleaning out their system after eating wood or whatever all winter.

LOL, thanks for nothin Rally

seriously, thanks to everyone whos posted ive learned alot from your posts.

One odd thing about our's rally is if they find a cedar or even a cedar block or post near the shore they'll knaw on it, not sure if it's the odor attracting them or what, im sure they're not eating it, just like to chew on it for some reason.

Spring is when I see the most cutting on pine's here, no idea how they can stand that bitter sap!

Jtrapper,
Maybe they have a date later and that cedar gives them breath "like the great outdoors". LOL

One thing the beaver really like here is lily pad roots. Those roots grow big too. They look like huge snakes floating in the water after the beaver pull them up. The shoreline will full of them sometimes.

J, had an old timer tell me once that beavs will eat cedar at times because of the natural insecticide contained in the cedar cambium. Took care of any internal parisites. makes sense to me. I have yet to see a beaver with tape worms like you will coon.

We have a lot of cedar swamps here in areas. I've trapped areas where they flooded cedar swamps. I've never noticed a beaver chewing on one though. I'll have to keep my eyes open for it. Those are white cedar though, are those down south red?

Eastern red cedar is what I have seen them eat here goldy. White cedar (American AV) may be a different story.

Ever seen them eating lily pads?Was hunting geese during the early season,several beaver spent an hour or so--eating lily pads --one right after the others.They looked like a bunch of couch potatoes--stuffing their faces with potatoe chips.
That is the only time I have ever seen them eat the pads--roots yes,but not the pads.
Tom

Red cedar is what i was talking about goldy.

Not actually watched them eat the pads bog but have seen the stub's sticking up where something ate them and wasn't anything else around but beaver so figured they had done it.

I know they love to pack their dams with the things!

Tom,
I watched a two year old eat a pad once too. It would roll them up in like a ball and really go to it.Rolled them with it's front feet. I like watching them eat small sticks, like eating an ear of corn. They can really get those sticks rolling with their front feet.
Dave,
That is interesting. I'm betting they eat alot of things we don't know about or why.
A buddy of mine had a pet Porky and it just went crazy for potatoe chips. LOL He said it didn't like BBQ though.

It is amazing how fast a beaver can eat the bark off a stick. Noisy things too when they are doing it.

When I used to have time to take the boat fishing we would see alot of beaver swimming the shores basically grazing either on green leaves or grasses. Much of it was overhanging the waters edge and they never had to go on dry ground unless they wanted to.

Have any of you ever seen where a beaver has cut deadwood? or has it all been live?

They don't seem to cut much dry wood, but I've seen them chew dry poles under ice as an attempt to escape a snare, but not much up on the ice, like a minor amount on a safety stick cabled above the ice. I believe the moisture in the wood, or lack there of,makes chewing dry wood tough on there teeth. The moisture works as a lubricant in green wood, or under ice in the water.

Like Rally, I don't remember seeing where beaver chewed clear through dry wood, but I have noticed where they chewed on dead wood for some reason or other.

ive seen where theyve chewed on fence posts and i was surprised but am definitely sure it was a beaver.

I trapped a colony up by vergas minnesota a few years. They built a lodge on the bank back in a nook There hut was made of solid mud not a stick on it It was along a creek that was open. I could see all their runs and every bit of water up and down the river not a stick in site but there were hundreds of lily pad roots floating everywhere. I caught 6 beaver 5 black ones and 1 dark brown one.Walked up and down the creek no slides going out of the water any where for cutting any trees. Where these beaver surviving on roots alone? I know they have to chew wood to keep their teeth ground down.

I too have seen ponds, usually surrounded by bog, where they eat all pond vegetation, mostly lily pads. Maybe those roots are hard enough to put some wear on the teeth. I guess I've never really paid that much attention to how hard they really are.

This has been a great thread and verifys a lot of my thoughts on beaver and castor.
I will say in my area I use castor mounds throughout the fall and winter and till our season goes out in mid March. Upon occasion I will have a beaver that will not react to a cstor mound set, but it is usually after a catch or two has been made in the area.
I also have seen beaver feed on nothing but roots. I was trapping a strip mine that had a lot of what we call fragmites growing in the water. At first I thought rats were eating these roots but after a close look found out that beaver were feeding the dang things. There was loads of floating vegetation on the water and it looked like rats had been feeding the area. The only problem was, it would have taken a hundred rats to make the cuttings these beaver made.
Rally that was a very good explanation you gave on beaver interacting with lure.

has it been your alls experience that southern beaver dont build feed beds?

i dont fool with castor mound sets and leg traps anymore. too much work and trouble for me and much greater chance of escape. i find it much easier, effective, and quicker to whack the beaver in conibear traps by setting heavy and staying away from the lodge if possible. once i get the numbers down to a beaver or two, i will use lure but i still use a conibear trap and i pull him into a tight spot. if only a couple beaver, still do it the same way and many times never use any lure. i like to keep the lure set for last case scenario if in a real small closed environment. if i get a wise guy once in awhile, a snare or leg trap set blind usually takes care of that.

I haven't noticed any difference in response to lure in ponds or streams/rivers. I think it depends on individual beaver/colonies and their experience with previous trapping pressure. If I run into educated beaver, a VERY small drop of sac oil is what I use to lure the set, otherwise it's usally a castor lure.

I will add that when I run into beaver that are educated, the snare is my go to tool of choice.

great topic --learned alot.

Straight beaver oil is a good attrator about any time of year. You can get a very controlled response from beaver oil on a stick, and have them set their feet down in a predictable manner.

Tell me why, when I'm trapping below the Mason- Dixon line why I see more sirn of beaver taking a couple of bites out of a tree trunk and then moving on, they will not cut the tree down, many times i will watch this tree, some times at a latter date i will notice fresh bites and some times there never is a new bite.This mostly is done on Cypress tree's and the knee's. Are these some type of territorial markers or are they just trying to wear there teeth down some.?Ihave seen this in the northern areas that i have trapped also but not like i've seen it in the south.When the tree is situated in the right location i have used this to my advantage to take some smart beaver, one of those happened to be a big female this summer in a pond...Carl

Fuzzy face ive never trapped anywhere for beaver except down here so just figured that was normal.

Mnbvrtrapper,
When I read your post about the beaver, I knew before I finnish the post that the beaver were black in color. It is quite common here,and bog country, to find houses with little or no wood in them. They are most always black beaver(black all the way around, no brown bellies)and rarely over 60" in size. I'm guessing the brown beaver you caught in that colony was either the adult female or male and most likely the female. The black gene from my experience seems to be dominant in the male. Like I posted in my above post it is also quite common here to have huge rafts of cattails tubers, big enough to support a large beavers weight in the centers.These ponds also are real suckers for fresh popple poles about mid January.
Carl,
I'm not sure about the bite marks on the cypress knees, as I learn something from every colony I trap, I have to because they are getting smarter!!
Call me crazy but here is my take on some of the trees that have just been chewed a couple times.I have noticed what I am about to describe most often in the month of Sept. and early Oct.
I believe that the adult male beaver marks trees he wants cut, like a work assignment if you will. I quite often see where an establish colony, to mean an adult pair, three to five two year olds, and three to six yearlings. Not a new colony with a pair of 2.5 year old beaver. I believe a young pair works and builds evenly in labor until the female has pups then the work is done primarily by the male and pups in either age class. It has been my experience that the adult female in a colony has the darkest, (least used)teeth, to me meaning she is cutting less wood.
I have noticed here that there tends to be alot of areas where the young popple have been chewed or marked with just a couple bite marks, usually in bunches or 5-10 trees, close to each other.I started looking at these chop(bite)marks and noticed they tended to all be made by a large set of teeth, or an adult beaver.Since I was going into the ponds every day I was able to keep track of them. They were cut in bunches and the teeth cutting them were smaller, and like the marked trees, seemed to be cut in bunches, like they were marked. The first time I observed this I thought it was pretty neat but didn't really think about it much. The following year I got a contract to remove beaver from a ditch line that was four miles long and had a two track running adjacent to it, but the beaver had the two track flooded. There was too much brush to canoe it so I was walking it.They wanted to drain this area to access a large track of land to the south. This ditch and the area where I came into it had already been logged about 6 years before and was regrowth popple(beaver candy).On the way into where I was trapping there were two colonies of beaver about 2 miles from the ones I was contracted to trap.As I was driving in to my contract I noticed a bunch of areas with the popple cut like mentioned above, with just a couple bites removed and again in bunches, and again in Sept.(mid).Every day I watched the progress of these trees and the way they cut them, both colonies had bunches of trees marked and all were cut in bunches again. These were about 12 years ago, and I have notice this in several colonies many miles apart. Other than those trees being cut in bunches the trees seemed to be about the same age class all around them. They weren't the closest to the house, and some weren't the easiest to access. Why these colonies chose to cut in these areas and leave the same type feed source both closer to the house and easier to get is a mystery to me. I've also observed where beaver will drop trees into the water and cut others that fall into the water before they start cutting the first ones up. It also seems they cut up the trees down stream first if there is any current. I'm guessing the felled tree upstream may divert some current and aid in the cutting of the trees down stream. Who knows for sure but it keeps things interesting.

How many of you believe a beaver has to eat wood to keep their teeth trimmed?

I imagine they can grind them down theirself in their sleep if they grind teeth like I do when im asleep, lol.

Had one the other day that was odd though, had white teeth! Ever see that?

That is extremely interesting Rally. I have often wonderd if they didnt pass up trees of the same species because of a nutrient quantity in the cambium layer. Most trees at different stages of growth will produce different properties within the cambium which is the thin layer within the bark that beaver actually eat and digest. I have also witnessed trees marked then dropped by younger of the colony but never touched agin after being dropped. That still puzzles me. Any thought on that one Rally?

Probably the same reason they chew 4x4 post into on boat docks Dave, lol. Nothing better to do, lol.

It was my thoughts that all rodents has to chew on something to keep it's teeth worn down.

I believe it is pure rumor that beaver have to chew wood to keep their teeth in check. I've got a movie, taken while a camera was installed in a beaver lodge for like a year,and it shows beaver grinding their teeth in their sleep. It was explained that the inner core of the teeth grows constanly and they simply grind them as they sleep, and why they are always sharp unless broken.It actually shows beaver grinding their teeth while sleeping, grooming habits, youg pups learning to swim in the house etc.Really good footage of beaver foot placement while swimming , landing, eating and grooming. Shows them shredding small peeled sticks for bedding in the house also.
The movie also shows some footage of beaver pond visitors swimming. You should see the way a Porky swims, looks like he is riding a bike.LOL
I was surprised at all the noises a beaver makes also. Squeeks, grunts, chattering,yawning etc.
Dave,
I wondered the same thing about the nutrients, but I have noticed they just take the trees out in clusters. The regrowth is just inches apart, and most cutting areas if viewed from above seem to be shaped like a culdasec(SP) or lollipop. Smaller at the waterline and expanding in the woods.It's fairly flat here, and the banks are normally gently sloping areas. I'm kinda thinking it may have something to do with the way they drop them or drag them out.If they make a small clearing as they cut away from the water they can fell the small trees, with the tops away from the water, making the buts toward the water. It would be easier to drag them out that way. Ever notice how they leave a larger tree that hangs up when falling(deadman)? Do you think they know it could fall on them and kill them? So they just leave it until the wind blows it down, or on a larger tree they just want the tops and can't reach it so leave it. Could also be that they keep the "clearings they cut small so they have less worry from soaring raptors being able to just drop in on them. The smaller clearings would be tougher for a raptor to manuever in giving them more opportunity to get back to the water. How many times you ever seen more than one beaver back up in the woods cutting trees. I don't think I ever have. Most often it is one cutting and one near the water edge.
Ever notice how much more muscular a river beaver is than a pond beaver? I'm betting it is from swimming against the current at least 50% of the time.LOL

Rally
The strange part about the Cypress trees and knee's is that i dont think that i have ever seen one cut completely down by a beaver.I also wonderd if it was the same beaver or a differnt beaver that would come back and mark/bite the tree . That is very intereting about the black beavers lodge with no sticks.Over the years i've probably caught 8-10 of them around heare, as best as i can remember,lol they all lived in bank dens.One thing i did notice with all that were caught is that there under fur was pilled.Just full of little balls of fur, wadded up, a real pain to try and comb out.
I have seen many times were a beaver has walked in threw a patch of willows, maybe as far as 12-15ft to cut down a sapling the same size as the one;s it just walked by. Go figuire...
Without a dought beaver in rivers are more muscular ,to me they are even built differnt, they are streamlined , they take on the shape of a pointed bullet,( i call them torpedo beaver) ocasionally i will catch one of those big sloppy fat beaver out of a river, but not often, it usually happens if i get on a section of river that hasn't been trapped for awhile. Many of the beaver that i catch out of strip mine ponds will be more muscular, they dont have the lose floppy skin.I always figuerd it was there diet, mostly rocks, LOL........Carl

I've noticed many times beaver only taking a bite or two out of a tree and moving on. I always thought they were just "tasting". As far as noises, I've noticed beaver being very vocal. Lot's of whines, grunts, squeaks, etc. The noisiest beaver I ever saw was at a place where someone had just blown the dam and it's pond was going down fast. The first thing I saw it do was refresh all it's castor mounds, which I thought was kind of strange, because some of them were a ways from water with the rapidly receding water. The beaver never shut up, and at times was quite loud.

Carl,
Are those bite marks visible from the water, so that they could be seen by a beaver swimming by?I think I've carried a couple of those beaver eating rocks! Seems they were always a couple miles from the truck and they got bigger the farther I got from the truck!! Must be tough on an old guy like you.LOL
Goldy,
I've seen the trees chewed a couple times and not later cut. Could be alot of reasons they didn't cut them. I'm guessing they didn't feel safe, like a blid spot they couldn't see very far, maybe too dry, maybe Bomagillian(SP),maybe spooked by a predator,or maybe taste poorly to them. Wouldn't be any fun if we had all the answers.

Rally
Yep any beaver could see the bite marks when swimming by, heck Ray Charles could of seen em.
Just because you aint got any grey hair yet dont mean your not a Dina sour . LOL..Keep your boots up and your head down..Carl

Keep your boots up and your head down


Good Advice, Drip Dry,LOL.

Dang Carl, now you have me thinking. And your telling on yourself, saying I don't have any Grey hair. They say ones eye sight is the second thing to go!!!!

As for goofy things ive seen beaver do, had one going out of a swamp walking up hill a good 100 yards to cut down seedling pines once!

Another spot they were climbing a steep rocky cliff to mow down the shrubbery around a million dollar house when there was plenty of vegetation around the lake they were living in, it was summer time!

Flooded willows are always the same deal Carl, they go right by a hundred to cut the one near the bank. No idea why they do that.

One thing you can count on in the south though is they will ALWAYS build their main dam in the biggest brier/honeysuckle vine thicket they can find! Just fought my way into one of those this evening, look like ive been on a prom date with Freddie Krueger now, lol

I noticed that in MS. J. Always felt like a pin cushion after fighting my way in.lol I suppose they build dams in those types of locations because they feel more secure and protected by the cover. I know on the river I trap they will not sit and eat outside of the lodge without some sort of overhead protection. At sometime in history there must have been a raptor big enough to carry those hogs off and they aint forgot it yet! lol

Great information on this post! Rally, J trap, Paul and all other who have contributed!

On first ice out, we hit rivers here in SE Nebr fairly hard.

Just as soon as ice is out, a bait stick next to any beaver activity works like a charm.

Seem like you get the 2 year old most on a bait stick.

After about 7-10 days of open water, bait sticks loose their effectiveness and castor based lures shine. Its like they all got their belly full of fresh feed, and a bait stick doesnt trip their trigger as much, still works, but not to the extreme as on ice out.

Now here is something interesting. around here, hackberry is a beaver magnet come ice out. It will outproduce ANY wood Ive tryed. Most of our lowlying wood that is normal beaver feed is small banks of maple or cottonwood. Give them a piece of hackberry and they will just zoom right in on it, no matter if theyve got a willow, maple,cottonwood bank full right behind it. They will come in to hackberry like its the last piece of food they will ever eat. It works so good, that I will cut and use hackberry, if I can find enough, at every set no matter what Ive got handy close by. its worth it to cut in advance and pack it in.

Wonder if other locations across country have seen this??

I dont even bother cutting away the bark most of time, it just works that good after ice out.

Around here, you never see the amount of bait sticks that are knawed off like you do hackberry.

Many times, youve got one beaver dead at end of drowner or rod, and another has came by and choppedf off the bait stick.

Shoot, just reminds me. I need to get my chainsaw running before I can go beaver trapping!.

Truely, I'd rather go w/o lure, than hackberry, the first week of ice out.

R

Your onto something here Rich. There must be something about Hackberry not just the bark but the fruit as well. Beavs will go out of there way here in the spring for Hackberry. No other time but spring. The coon will also go WAY out of their way for hackberries throughout the winter. there has to be a reason for it but I sure dont know what it is.

Our popple has the same effect Rich, especially it seems if it's greenish colored, and smooth. I've seen beaver go to a castor mound with popple, with no trap there at the time, and grab the popple off the mound without even stopping to sniff the lure/castor. I think bait really helps, especially on 1/2 submerged 330's, to get them to commit. I'm not even sure what hackberry looks like, I think we have it here though. I'll have to look into it and try it for fun.

Dave,
If you would put a scope on that rifle you wouldn't have to do so much shooting and spook them beaver into the lodge.LOL

Like you said rally, the eyes are the second thing to go!! LOL

Wife says the first thing went a LONG time ago! LOL

I know on the river I trap they will not sit and eat outside of the lodge without some sort of overhead protection.

Correct you are Dave, remember that little beaver I raised for awhile? Id take him outside, he would follow you around like a dog and always stop as soon as he got between your feet, he didn't like being out in the open, even in the living room. Always more content if had something over head.

Sure do J. Bet you learned a ton watchin that critter grow. Raised a ton of coon and there cool to watch but beaver flat out intrigue me.

Main thing i learned from him is they are stubborn! If they are wanting to go a certain way or place they're going! No matter how many times id push him back he would start right back over trying to get to one corner, would do it until i put him up for the night, lol.

Next day same thing, he would try to go into that one corner he had never been in before, they're real real nosey! Ive used that stubborness to my advantage alot since watching him.

Jtrapper,
A friend of mine with six kids once told me that persistance pays off, and he had the grocery bill to prove it!!!

Goldy, I always wanted to try some popple down here for bait, wonder if when Im at MN or WI convention in summer, if one could saw some pieces and throw in freezer when I got home, to keep fresh till the following spring?

Dave, always thought if someone could make a "hackberry oil" it would be a killer lure.

Seems all the hackberrys are long gone, but have seen fresh coon dung with hackberrys in them this week even.

Sure, I'll cut you some.

Thanks to everyone who contributed to this post and made it such a wealth of information. i learned way more than i expected.

I think everyone learned alot from this tread one of the best I have read on here to date. Crutch

This is definately the best discussion I have ever read on Trapperman. A ton of knowledge and information was shared right here. This needs archived!

One thing I'd like to add. Someone made mention in an earlier post that they had heard about castor mounds being active year round in some parts of the south. That is very true on some of our large waterways where we have overlapping beaver territories. Some of them stay muddy year round and are ever growing in size. I know where several are that are right at 3 feet tall and probably 6 or 7 feet in diameter.

I found Rally's info about the beaver grinding their teeth while sleeping very interesting. I just assumed that they had to chew to stay sharp. Never thought about them grinding them. I have seen several places where beaver have came out on the bank and chewed on lighter pine stumps and logs. These are very hard and rich in resin. I know they're not eatin' it. Just figured they were using them to sharpen their teeth.

Anyway, great thread. Would love to see it archived!

Can we get this archived?????