Christianity and magic

If your Christian ( or Jewish) highly recommend listening to the 14min -23 min section of this. Found it very very interesting

It was interesting. Some of the Tman crew will bust a spring if they watch it. Or just rip on us Catholics.

I'm a Christian and watched 14-23 min section. Didn't bust any of my springs.

There is a lot of evidence that King Solomon, as wise as he was, allowed paganism, evil, and wickedness into the Kingdom. Its the whole reason that part of Israel fell.

I think there is good reason that the Bible does say good things about his father King David, but is rather very transparent on Solomon. Talks about it all through the Bible.

i believe magic works the same way i believe there are unicorns hidden among the giant sequoias

I actually think unicorns probably did exist at one time; as well as centaurs, minotaurs, etc.

Now whether there are unicorns hiding amongst the sequoias, I don't know.

Interesting. You claimed to be Catholic , yet your posts are anti Catholic in most posts.

Watched about 5 minutes of it. Don't know where for sure the guy was getting his information from or how true it was and not too worried about it to be honest. Like most videos it's mostly is about getting views and I'm sure he plays to a certain crowd

How's that?

Talked to him in private and he's honestly super passionate about his work. I me a you gotta be to writes the scripts and do the research he does. Sent me a PDF of all the notes and references he did for his demonology video and yeah.....

This is another piece of his work and it's amazing imo

Honestly it's not really supposed to bust any springs or anything just something interesting alot of people are probably not aware of. Idk I found it cool and worth sharing

That's all good and fine but you would have to do some research to try and decide how true his reference material was. I've seen Satanist that are pretty passionate about there stuff and can produce books to reference their statements but it doesn't make it true. I'm not saying what he said was true or not.

I'd ask if you put stock in the Bible and if you have studied about spiritual warfare, demons and fallen angels from it?

Think about your posts , and how Catholics feel about birth control and abortion .
I'm talking Catholics 50 60 years ago.
Not sure where they changed , but , it's seeming like a lot of things. Nothing maters anymore except what you want or feel.
Morals are a thing of the past.

I've seen them.

Giant sequoias?? Lol

Yes sir in all fairness I've chatted with satanists too , Norse pagans ,Jews , Catholics, Buddhists ,Hindus ,muslims , wiccans ect
That being said I feel you have to be an idiot to just plain believe everything your told. Honestly feel that's a big fault of society right now, the whole social training that has people in the mind set that you listen and don't question certain people. Teachers , politicians that's are supposed to be on your side , preachers and other religious leaders ect. Makes mass manipulation and the like very easy to the point you can show undeniable proof of something but if one of those types gets up and says no thats wrong most will just go along with it. See it constantly.Stuff like this gets your mind going and asking questions. Idk most people prefer to just be told what to think but in reality I feel it should be more you hear something it peaks your interest and you go looking more on your own. But asking too many questions is also frowned upon ( ask me how I know lol) so yeah

I would agree. Just remember the the forbidden fruit peaked Adam and Eves intrest too. So be careful your intrest doesn't take you done the wrong path.
For me the Bible is the foundation of truth, and I'll be clear I'm not talking about what I'm told of the Bible, and if it doesn't line up with the teaching in the Scriptures from a spiritual standpoint I am highly suspicious of it.

Wolfy u didn't answer my question

No where in the Bible does it tell you to blindly follow religious leaders. You are to test them by Scripture. If they deviate from Scripture, they are false teachers.

To be honest I really don't think the modern Bible is what it used to be and I 100% believe stuff has been removed and edited don't trust it 100% the bible and God are two different things imo. But that's a different conversation I'd prefer not to get into.
But as far as the spiritual warfare ill simply just say yes and leave it at that

I did t say the Bible said that was SOCIETY

The Bible condems all sorts of sorcery; no such thing as "white magic".

Religious beliefs are all beliefs in magic. It doesn't mean there isn't some truth in them. Religion is mostly just used to control people and especially to take their money.

Keith

[/quote]
Giant sequoias?? Lol[/quote]
Nope. I went south rather than north. My bad!!!

It's quite simple really .
Follow the TEN COMMANDMENTS and you'll be just fine.
Or follow the Golden rules , Do unto others as you would have them do unto you!

Todays society , is very strange and way off track !

Will those things save u? And if you haven't followed them perfectly then what?

Wolf, I didn’t watch. We need to avoid religious topics here in my opinion. Same for vaccines and politics. I am guilty.

If u don't like them don't open them. Isn't that hard. There's threads here regularly that don't intrest me and I just don't open them.

I want to know what Hal thinks

I have complete confidence in my KJV of the Bible, God has blessed it for four hundred years. As a professing Christian, where else would you look for guidance?

There's this thing scholars look at when studying manuscript evidence they refer to as "stability". Was the text passed copy to copy, century to century intact, that's the question. The answer is yes.

Amen Band B and Waggler

God is the word and the word is God. Either you believe the Bible is the inspired word of God or you don't. If you do you believe all of it.
If you want to pick the parts you want to believe we'll that's not a path I would chose.

I used to feel very similar to you Wolfdog91 untill I attended a church with expository preaching, that stuck to the word line by line and brok it down word by word using its Greek and Hebrew translations ans backing up what of the musical translation it could mean with other biblical passages.

Getting into the right church makes a huge difference.

… what in the jumped up (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) is going on in here

LOL It would be very nice if people would follow those rules.
I do see your point, bad people are everywhere , so make sure you carry !

Marty ain't around to argue and bicker with Boco anymore so WolfDog is stirring the pot. Thought things were too quiet I guess. lol.

I agree with the Yes Sir about certain interests having the potential to take one down the wrong path. I've been there. I went down paths of "truth" other than the Written Word and it has the potential to get one into very dark places quickly. I think the allure of it is gaining access to "unknown" knowledge or having questions answered that religion did not answer for them. I think it gives some people a sense of superiority in a world they don't fully understand, nor do most other people.

What I think is that every one of these paths is full of some truth, some a lot of truth, but they are not the real and complete Truth. Like any good lie, especially believable ones, they are based on truth and then manipulated with some deception.

We live in a supernatural world. We are not merely "physical beings having a worldly experience, but rather spiritual beings having a human experience." The Nachash is very real; he is the prince of this world, and he has an infantry in the form of other fallen angels and demons. They know the mysteries of the universe, they were there when it was created. Many of these paths will lead one to this direction and cast doubt on the True Word of God, as it will seem they have the key to forbidden knowledge or may actually be true "light bearers" to bring people in darkness into the light.

This kind of stuff will continue to grow and the rise of the occult will become common place here. Just remember, none of those paths make promises, just innuendos. They cannot make a promise as God Almighty does. His sacrificed son Jesus Christ made a promise that He and only He is the Way, and the Truth, and the Life.

Our entire Bible is nothing but Supernatural, from the very first sentence where God said He created the heavens and the earth, to the end. Everything in between is full of supernatural oddities and miracles from the flood, to the plagues in Egypt, to the parting of the Red Sea, to the ghosts and witches in Samuel, to the virgin birth and resurrection of Jesus Christ.

… good post Chancey I guess … still don’t understand why he’d only heal one lepor out of an entire colony of them .. I bet the others were pist while that lucky sob jumped around celebrating like he won the lottery lol

I thought he healed all of them and only one came back to thank him

… no wonder he’s cool with cancer and heart disease now … ungrateful sob’s lol

Oh how u see the world makes me laugh

Sad response for someone with such a quick wit !

Lots of things in the Bible I don't understand at all or make sense at the time, but that doesn't mean that I don't believe it. I believe that Jesus can see right down into the pits of our hearts and and all of our wickedness and all of our true feelings that we keep within.

That is why I have to get to Heaven, because I have a lot of pertinent questions that only God can answer.

… like laughing at me or with me ? There’s a difference from what I understand lol

.. that’s a Levantine religion.. there are a few of them.. Muslims believe in the same Yahweh (Jesus’ dad) .. I’m of European stock and according to the word my ancestors are burning for not believing in a religion foreign to them … seems a little hypocritical is all … I intend to wander off in the thicket and let the coyotes get their revenge in my end time and I believe it won’t go any further than that

My granddad who was from Texas told me once " life is easier if you always believe they are laughing with you"

Some guys believe they are women but that doesn't make it true. Lol

True, it is of Hebrew origin, but YHVH is NOT the same god as allah in the Quran. I have the Quran and have read it, and allah is NOT the same as the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

Islam was formed over 600 years after Christ's death. It is a perversion of Christianity at its best. Like I said earlier, all good and believable lies have some truth to them.

… you may or may not have missed the point

…What I never understood from a kid is that why would a being that had the power to cure good peoples ailments not do it … or even create them in the first place .. kind of sadistic from my weak minded point of view

Yessir …I’m good with transgender’s going to the big h … they’re too off balance for a smooth landing … wierd crap for sure lol

Savell in all seriousness he did heal all our ailments when his son died on the cross for us we just haven't been released from the hospital yet

The Muslims believe in the same God, who fathered Jesus and in Jesus and Mary too. Jesus is seen by Muslims as only second to Mohamed.







The Muslims are out of Abraham too and kept their grandsire's God.

Keith

… cowboy church poetry right there for sure … I’ve always wanted to believe just too skeptical as it never made sense to me … I guess my only hope is there’s high fin blues in that lake of fire lol

I've read their bible Keith. Like I said earlier, I think it is a perversion of Christianity.

Who do you think they are referring to when they say again and again that they must "fight" and "break" the pig and the cross? Whole religion is an evil, vindictive, scam conjured by the the prince of the world himself IMO.

Chancey, Jesus is the person the Muslims say will do that. The cross represents death in Islam the same as Christianity.

"Allah's Messenger (ﷺ) said, "The Hour will not be established until the son of Mary (i.e. Jesus) descends amongst you as a just ruler, he will break the cross, kill the pigs, and abolish the Jizya tax. Money will be in abundance so that nobody will accept it (as charitable gifts)."

Keith

…. You and me … people of European decent and our religions at the time… y’all’s beloved Zionists are no different to this day … look around we’ve been weakened to the point of obedient self destruction due to a foreign religion as far as I can tell … love thy neighbor .. turn the other cheek

Savell

… like laughing at me or with me ? There’s a difference from what I understand lol[/quote]
[/quote]

You do realize that without a core belief , you wander , like the Philistines did for 40 years in the desert .
Without any direction you wander from thought or feeling to the next.
No direction or commitment to self or life in general.
There has to be a core belief for you to be who you are.
Weather or not it's in your mind religious or not, you have a core belief.
I don't care if you think you're a mountain man from 1700's , you need to believe in yourself of something.
There has to be a drive of some kind to make you who you are.
Everyone is different , there's no set rules on how you think or behave.
It's free will to chose .
God is not a dictator , you live your life as it is , no influence other than what you believe.
God doesn't cause cancer or anything to cause you or yours pain or death.
He just gave you life , and man has thrown a wrench into that with abortion .
Free will as to what you do or believe , so is it easier to blame God for things that happen?
I don't know , but there's something that gets you going everyday.

Respectfully Keith, you and I read the Quran differently.

There are a lot of it that seems poetic and Jesus spoken, but a lot is evil as all get out. You will never convince me that they serve the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, and the lineage of King David and the Tribe of Judah. Allah, is notorious for not keeping his promises; he comes across as a crazed individual and Muhammad was a mad man IMO.

I agree with you Savell, so I'm just going to go out and say it cause this post will probably be zapped before long after this.

There were two seeds in the garden. Best I can tell today is that both of them claim a Jewish/Hebrew heritage. The ones from one seed, the Messianic line seem to be fair and noble and live by the Golden the Rule. The others from the other line, tend to be money hungry evil bankers. The latter rule the world because they rule the money and trick screw it at every turn. It is not Biblical. These are the folks that are within our government and cause friction and turmoil all over the world.

There is not a doubt in my mind that when the anti-christ does arrive, he will claim a Jewish heritage.

See everyone, Charles is confessing and repenting! He don't want anything to do with the lake of fire. Keep on Brother, the truth will set you free.

… y’all all might as well move to Mesopotamia …I’m going to Valhalla after the coyotes eat me lol

Wolfie done went and got back in the boat captains sauce, again.

… oh crap Chancy gets it … we’ve been used

I might have screwd up his moment of confusion when I suggested he not open these threads anymore.....

Mohamed or Allah weren't around until after 1400 AD , explain why they want to kill all unbelievers or infields ?
ISLAM is the only cult, or so called religion , that believes in killing all unbelievers .
Yep go back to the Old Testament and the killings , then go to the New Testament , which was before Allah .

… this is what we need to get back to at this point in time boys…



…turning the other cheek is getting us nowhere..

Emperor Constantine issued the Edict of Milan in 313, making Christianity legal in the Roman Empire, when he saw that it was growing to fast to stop. 10 years later, Rome made Christianity the official religion of the empire, when they saw how useful it was at controlling the lower people and slaves. Suffer now and obey those over you now and be richly rewarded in the next life.

Many years later, King Harold Bluetooth did the same thing starting in Denmark, leading to the near death of any religion besides Christianity, in the rest of non Christian Europe.

Keith

In this day and age we seem to be on a quest to find what is truth or a lie. It seems simple that when we nail it down to either truth or false then then rest is simple. If then that is all that is required to set the world back on its axis then maybe we should resort back to "bisha’h". It's an old fashioned lie detector in which a hot instrument such as a red hot spoon is touched to the one being accused ( or perhaps the accused victim ). If they are lying then their tongue will blister and thus guilty. If innocent then their tongue will not blister and they can go on their merry way.
Actually the system is based on the theory if a person is guilty they would be nervous and their tongue would be dry and thus would blister. If innocent they should not be nervous and would not get burned. So see, justice is only a stones throw back into history.

lol again Savell!

I think religion exists is because its hard to accept that bad things happen to people. It gives people a sense of control over the uncontrollable. This was a really big deal when 40 was old. People died from stuff like tooth infections. Every human society has and has had a religion.

I like this post

I didn't watch the first video and did watch some of the second

The bible teaches that you should not allow a witch to live
Exodus 22:18 KJV
Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live.

The verse right after that talks about putting a person down that commits beastiality so it kind of likens witchcraft with beastiality in that manner

The witch if endor was scared to death to show herself to Saul because she thought she would be put to death

The bible is absolutely against witchcraft in every way shape and form

The KJV is the one true and preserved perfect word of God in English that exists today. The book of Enoch is a bogus dead sea scroll forgery. Not a book from the original manuscripts of the word of God (Textus Receptus, Hebrew manuscripts) so everything in it is a lie or a truth that's meant to make you believe a lie

Angles did NOT breed with mankind and create giants. Anyone who reads the actual word of God can prove this wrong in 2-3 verses. I will share them below

1) the text of Genesis 6 that every other bible and false prophets wrest to try and make people believe this malarkey

Genesis 6:1-8 KJV
And it came to pass, when men began to multiply on the face of the earth, and daughters were born unto them, [2] That the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair; and they took them wives of all which they chose. [3] And the Lord said, My spirit shall not always strive with man, for that he also is flesh: yet his days shall be an hundred and twenty years. [4] There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown. [5] And God saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every imagination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. [6] And it repented the Lord that he had made man on the earth, and it grieved him at his heart. [7] And the Lord said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth; both man, and beast, and the creeping thing, and the fowls of the air; for it repenteth me that I have made them. [8] But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.

So we can see here clearly that "Men" began to multiply and they had many daughters. The "sons of God" meaning saved men who believe on Christ saw the daughters of "Men" meaning unsaved women and took them for their wives rather than saved women and had children with them. This upset God because their children grew up godless. So God puts a limit to how long men can live. Remember this is before the flood and Methuselah lived nearly 1000 years, anyway then saved men had children with the unsaved women, the heathen, and their children grew strong and became mighty men that were well known because they were so numerous. And God saw how wicked "Men" was, and God thought to destroy "Men" because he repented at the thought that he made "Men" at all, but Noah found favor in the sight of the Lord.

You see the mention of giants in verse 4? It's obvious that we are being told that in those days giants roamed the earth and also after those days. Meaning giants came before Genesis 6 and also after.

Nothing in that scripture says anything about angels mating with humans and creating giants. But the term "sons of God" is the only way a person can begin to believe that angels mated with humans. I will show you how false prophets wrest this scripture from the bible, and show you the verses that prove that the "sons of God" are just saved believer and not angels.

So for the verses that false prophets wrest and twist we first go to the book of Job

The first mention of the terms "sons of God" in the book of Job is in chapter 1. This is the time where Satan is contending with God claiming that Job will turn on God as soon as he is given a reason to do so. God knows better and let's Satan continue, but the bible tells us that the "sons of God" came to present themselves before the Lord. The reason dispensationalists, and other false prophets teach this "sons of God" doctrine is actually angels is because they don't believe anyone was saved and in heaven in the old testament. Here is the verse

Job 1:6 KJV
Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.

The first verse of chapter 2 says the same thing

Job 2:1 KJV
Again there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them to present himself before the Lord.

And one more time this term "sons of God" comes up on the book of Job and it's in chapter 38 when God is correcting Eliaphaz and Job's other friends who did not give an honest account of what God thought and decided to be fine judges of their brother. God comes to Job's defense. But dispensationalists and false prophets will tell you all about how Job was wrong. Lol I wonder what God would say about that.

Anyways those are supporting scriptures for the false "sons of God" are angels and bread with humans doctrine garbage.

Next I will show you the verses that prove that the "sons of God" are saved believers of mankind, but first remember that the bible teaches that angels neither marry or are given in marriage so that leads us to believe that they do not and cannot reproduce.

Now to John chapter 1
John 1:11-13 KJV
He came unto his own, and his own received him not. [12] But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Verse 11 we see that the "his" and "him" is Jesus Christ based off what verse 12 and the earlier verses in the chapter say. Verse 12 says very clearly that Jesus gave power to all those that Believe on him to become the "sons of God"
So if you are a bible believing Christian this one verse alone destroys that entire reprobate, dispensationalists doctrine but I will continue and use the book of Hebrews 12 to really knock it out of the park for everyone who doesn't understand.

First I must reiterate that my claim is that the "sons of God" are angels that mated with humans and created giants doctrine in complete and utter horse feathers and had absolutely no basis is reality or scripture.

Now for the home run we go to Hebrews chapter 1.
In Hebrews 1 we see where God specifically states that he never called angels "sons" and that all angels are supposed to worship Jesus just like the gospel believing Christians that are called the "sons of God"

I'm not going to post the whole chapter but I recommend you read Hebrews 1 in the KJV for context

Hebrews 1:4-6 KJV
Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they. [5] For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?
[6] And again, when he bringeth in the firstbegotten into the world, he saith, And let all the angels of God worship him.

The bible teaches that Jesus(he) hath an inheritance that had obtained a more excellent name than the angels(they). Then God ask "for which if the angels said he at any time, Thou art my son, this day have I begotten thee?"

This is rhetorical question because in verse 6 we see that his only begotten son is Jesus and the angels worship Jesus.

If that's not clear enough God does this thing where he repeats himself just to drive the point home.


Hebrews 1:13-14 KJV
But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
[14] Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

God goes on in verse 13 to state the same thing in a different manner. We know that Jesus sits at his right hand, not the angels or devil's at this point, because the lore referred to by the man in the video is that the devil's are the ones who made giants with the daughters of men.

In verse 14 we see very clearly that the angels and devil's are not sons because they are not heirs of salvation but are ministering spirits to those who are the heirs. Those heirs are the sons of God spoke about in Genesis 6, Job 1 and 2, and John 1. The way children of men become children of God are by believing on the name of the only begotten Son of God, Jesus Christ.

So I hope this clears up some stuff for all of those reading this thread.

After saying all this I will state that the videos that guy made look really well made, excellent editing and artwork used. Great titles, just all around good looking videos, but they are completely full of false doctrine.

Be careful what you believe, if it does not jive with the word of God (KJV) then it's bogus.

Obviously if you read the actual word of God then Genesis 6 is very very clear, the giants were already there. The "sons of God" were saved men who took unsaved women for their wives and raised unsaved children that knew not God. This is why God repented himself and wanted to destroy mankind

-Ken

Besides mainly just being used to manipulate people for some form of profit, the next main problem with almost all religions is that they create hate and division. Most people think their crazy, nonsensical belief is better than anyone else's crazy, nonsensical belief and therefore despise them and look down on them. Most people are indoctrinated at a young age, so they accept as true teachings, beliefs that seem ludicrous to an outsider. People, who choose a religion later in life, almost always screwed up majorly when young and are choosing a religion to make them feel better about themselves.

I sell to a lot of people who practice what we lump together as voodoo. I was talking to a customer from Togo about the beliefs of people from Benin, Ghana and the Americans who practice Santos and Santaria. He told me "They are all just silly. They don't know how it works." As an outsider, to me all those voodoo religions seem silly. I thought it was funny that the people of the varying, voodoo religions look down on each other just like the immense number of different Christian faiths look down on each other. I likewise see it as a little sad too.

Voodoo practioners actually consider themselves Christians too, just like the Mormons, who so many "good" Christians despise.

I believe that we are indeed made in God's image. I can't see him giving a crap about all the petty differences that men have created to control their fellow man. A being as awesome as God is well above the pettiness of man

Keith

You don't think God cares about false teachers that lead people to hades? Jesus says different.

Keith all can say is your general description of Christian and the Christian beliefs doesn't come close to describing me or my experience with the religion. Can it be manipulated by man for evil? Of course, man had corrected every institution they have ever been in. It's about your relationship with God, knowing his truth and finding a Church that puts those truth first and God first.

Here's a list of some of the huge multitude of Christian religions. Ignoring the many thousands of other religions, which of these is the one that contains the people that God won't send to suffer forever?

Alliance of Baptists
American Baptist
American Baptist Association
Baptist
Baptist (Missionary)
Baptist Bible Fellowship International
Baptist General Conference
Baptist- Independent
Conservative Baptist Association of America
Converge Worldwide (Baptist General Conference)
Cooperative Baptist Fellowship
Fellowship of Evangelical Baptist Churches in Canada
General Association of General Baptists
General Association of Regular Baptist
National Association of Free Will Baptists
National Baptist Convention of America
National Baptist Convention, USA
National Missionary Baptist Convention of America
North American Baptist Conference in Canada
Progressive National Baptist Convention
Southern Baptist Convention
United Baptist Convention of the Atlantic Province
Methodist
African Methodist Episcopal
African Methodist Episcopal Zion
Christian Methodist Episcopal (CME)
Free Methodist Church of North America
Methodist
United Methodist
Presbyterian
Cumberland Presbyterian Church
Presbyterian
Presbyterian Church in America
Presbyterian Church in Canada
Orthodox
Antiochian Orthodox Christian Archdiocese
Coptic Orthodox
Greek Orthodox
Greek Orthodox Metropolis of Toronto (Canada)
Orthodox
Orthodox Church in America
Romanian Orthodox Episcopate
Ukrainian Orthodox
Ukrainian Orthodox Church of Canada
Episcopal
Anglican
Anglican Church of Canada
Episcopal
Catholic
Catholic
Roman Catholic
Lutheran
American Association of Lutheran
Association of Free Lutheran Congregations
Evangelical Lutheran in America
Lutheran
Lutheran Church of Missouri Synod
Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod
Reformed
Calvinist
Christian Reformed Church in North America
Evangelical Presbyterian
Reformed
Spirit-Filled
Apostolic Church of Pentecost of Canada
Assemblies of God
Calvary Chapel
Charismatic
Church of God
Church of God (Anderson, IN)
Church of God (Cleveland, TN)
Church of God (Pentecostal)
Church of God by Faith
Church of God in Christ
Church of God of Prophecy
Church of Our Lord Jesus Christ of the Apostolic Faith
Congregational Holiness
Elim Fellowship
Fellowship of Christian Assemblies
Foursquare Gospel
Full Gospel
Full Gospel Baptist Church Fellowship
General Conference Church of God (Seventh Day)
General Conference of Churches of God
Holiness
International Pentecostal Holiness
New Frontiers
Open Bible
Pentecostal
Pentecostal Assemblies of Canada
Pentecostal Assemblies of the World
Pentecostal Church of God
Restorationist
United Pentecostal Church
United Pentecostal Church International
Vineyard
Vineyard Churches Canada
Christian
Apostolic
Armenian Apostolic Church
Associated Gospel Churches of Canada
Berean Fellowship
Bible
Bible Fellowship
Brethren
Christian and Missionary Alliance
Christian Brethren (Brethren Assemblies)
Church of Christ
Church of the Brethren
Church of the Nazarene
Church of the Nazarene in Canada
Church of the United Brethren in Christ
Churches of Christ
Community
Congregational
Conservative Congregational Christian Conference
Council of Mennonite Brethren Churches
Disciples of Christ
Evangelical
Evangelical Covenant
Evangelical Free
Evangelical Free Church
General Council of Mennonites
Grace communion International - Canada
Grace Gospel Fellowship
House Churches
Independent
Independent Bible
Independent Fundamental Churches of America
Interdenominational
International Council of Community
Mennonite
Messianic Judaism
Missionary
Moravian
National Association of Congregational
Nazarene
Netherlands Reformed Congregations
Non-Denominational
Old Order Amish Church
Other Christian
Quaker
Salvation Army
Seventh Day Adventist
The Christian Congregation
United Church of Canada
United Church of Christ
United House of Prayer
Uniting Church (Australia)
Wesleyan

Is any of these even the right one?

Keith

I could probably attend 3/4s of those.

A lot of those are different denominations, not different religions.

Bingo

Keith you seem more interested in looking for evidence than finding truth if u get where I'm coming from

Religions or denominations are used as a way to divide

Every religion or denomination has infiltrators that push their own agenda

Assuming God is not real because of the wickedness of man is the mark of a fool
Psalm 14:1 KJV
The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.

Men who make religions are fools

The bible clearly teaches that pure religion is visiting the fatherless and widows in their affliction and remaining unspotted from the world.
Folks from every religion practice pure religion.

Religion saves iterally no one on the planet

Salvation is only by faith on the Lord Jesus Christ

Everyone is a sinner and deserves death, the only way to be saved it for you to be covered by the blood of Jesus

It's literally that simple

These post are always restated to support the writers bias.

You realize what you just stated is your religion, right?

I don't really disagree, but disagreement has existed in the church from the beginning.
Having different opinions of what certain verses mean doesn't make one a heretic.
It sounds like you belong with the faith alone denominations.
What many churches do is add faith plus ------whatever.

Well if you see it that way it's fine, but the "religion" that I came out of Independent fundamental Baptist would disagree with me obviously because they believe IFB to be the best, but even in the IFB you have people who preach multiple different types of salvation (sinless perfection, lordship salvation, repent of your sins, and then faith alone) so even within the IFB they don't agree all as one.

The bible never said we should start a religion. The bible said we should believe correctly, Jesus said we should believe correctly

I'd call myself a bible believing Christian. And many other types of Baptist would do the same

So I don't subscribe to religion. I don't see how that's me stating my religion. More stating exactly what it is I believe

There are no churches full of people who believe faith alone and preach against religion, though I'd probably go if there were

And yes most religions or denominations add something to faith which is how they create a religion. Man made traditions taught as doctrine. I think Jesus spoke about that a bit.

Anyways yes I am faith alone. Every saved Christian is

Agree with your last post Ken. Not a doubt in my mind that Jesus Christ did NOT come down here to form some kind of religion. He came to save souls from eternal damnation via their sins. Only His blood was worthy. That message is really all that matters, our differing interpretations of Genesis 6 does not take away from the Truth that is Jesus Christ and what He did for mankind.

My point is that I don't see God, being the greatest Being, condemning any of his children to suffer eternally, if their beliefs don't fall exactly in line with reality. What seems to be consequential differences to most of us, petty as we are, surely has no meaning to a being of God's magnitude.

I believe in a great and loving creator, not a small and petty one. If God wanted us all to believe the same, he could easily accomplish it.

Just like a good father wants his children to get along, and loves them all despite their idiosyncrasies, I believe God wants us to get along and to stop worrying about, what to him, must be vastly minor differences in opinion.

Keith

I always hate when people say to fear God or to fear Jesus.

In Galatians 4:7, Jesus says:

"King James Bible
Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ."

I believe we are all God's children and as his children, should act in love of God, not fear of him. There is a vast difference in fear and in loving respect.

I don't see our just God condemning any of our brothers and sisters, through him, who try to live well and treat others with love and respect, while holding varying beliefs.

Keith

100% brother

None of God's children will suffer eternal (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman). But it is very clear in the bible that there are three types of people. Children of God (saved), children of Belial (reprobate), and children of Adam (unsaved)

So there can't be a free pass for everyone. You only become a child of God by faith on Jesus Christ. That means repenting of any other kind of false salvation or religion or thought on how to be saved and turning or repenting to the gospel of Christ and putting all of your faith on Jesus'perfect finished works for all of your salvation. It's really simple

The bible is clear, this is how you because a child of God
John 1:12-13 KJV
But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

He is a loving God, and He loves us dearly. However, he ain't our buddy or our friend IMO, but rather a loving Fatehr; He is the Lord God Almighty and He deserves our worship and respect.

God did want us all to believe the same and know the Truth. That's why He sent His only son down here to prove it via Jesus' sacrifice on the Cross. Even though that is the most documented death and eyewitness account in written history, many still don't believe it, or find fault in it.

The bible clearly teaches that it's a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God

Jesus specifically preached that you should only fear God and not men

Matthew 10:28 KJV
And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman).

And Jesus also taught that if you were of his flock then you would hear his voice

John 10:25-30 KJV
Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me. [26] But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you. [27] My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: [28] And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. [29] My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. [30] I and my Father are one.

And once you are of his flock the you can never be plucked from the Father's hand. This is eternal security held by the most high God

So all of this "we are all God's children" junk just doesn't jive with the bible. It is what it is. No one is gonna force you to believe it, but attacking every religion while creating your own isn't any different than say the Godless morman's or unbelieving Jews. Everyone wants what they think to be the truth. You're no different than anyone else. We are all sinners and all deserve H3||. Claiming you don't is just not true.

Jesus specifically preached that most people and most so called "christians" would go to H3||. It's not wrong for sinners to be punished, but rather just. As God is just

Matthew 7:13-14 KJV
Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat: [14] Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

Like I said it is what it is. No matter how badly someone doesn't want it to be so.

The reason folks can't understand judgement is also clearly written about in the bible

Proverbs 28:5 KJV
Evil men understand not judgment: but they that seek the Lord understand all things.

I will never believe God would send His only son to die on a cross to save mankind and then save those who ridicule His Son. John 11:25, Jesus said, " I am the way, the truth, and the light; he who believes in me shall live even if he dies and everyone who lives and believes in Me shall never die."

How does one get around this scripture when it comes to all being His children. Aren't we are all God's creation, but not all His children?
KJV 1 john 3:10
By this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither is he that loveth not his brother.

I do see a little wiggle room about your last statement about trying to live well and treat others right. maybe with Romans 2:14 - For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves, but that might only apply to those who have never had knowledge of Jesus.

When we pick and chose scripture to support what we want to believe but ignore other scripture that doesn't lie up with what we want to believe then we are creating OUR own religion not following God's teachings.

Sorry, I honestly didn't waste my time watching this....But...

I suspect Jesus didn't want people horning in on his walking on water, wine from water and other acts.

After my personal experience with seeing organized religion destroying my church, which was made up of friends and family we came together to help each other and praise god, I have trouble believing in anything that has been edited by man such as any bible. Today I believe in heaven and (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) and a god almighty and I try to live my life right and if in the end that’s not enough then I will burn in (This word is unacceptable on Trapperman) and I can except that but if it is then I will go to heaven but until we die no one knows who’s right and who’s wrong.

Christianity is magic. A magical belief system that postulates supernatural beings, God, Satan, angels, and demons, that interact with and influence human beings. Many religions unrelated to Christianity, like Shinto, postulate the same kinds of supernatural beings.

Like most other magical belief systems (religions), Christianity runs into contradictions and logical fallacies when put to the test. To sort out the conundrums, Christians tend to pick and choose the verses of their bible that are most convenient or self-serving. Virtually every Christian I've met does this, and they usually aren't hard to flush out. And they usually have their denials, rationalizations, and justifications for doing as they please.

Just because we don't know the cause of creation of matter, energy, time, space, and life, people invent religions to attempt to explain it all. But the rational conclusion, the one critical thinking leads us to, is that there is not enough evidence at this time to know the cause of creation. And so I am an agnostic.

And btw, if giant hominids once walked the earth, where is the fossil evidence?

Jim

Again, something from nothing is still nothing as far as I know. There is nothing more magical than all that exists popping into everything from nothing. So critical thinking would lead us to a creator.

critical thinking must then conclude a creator sprang from nothing

Take your pick Danny. It all started from somewhere. If you claim everything just popped into existence from nothing, then you truly believe in magic.

I guess since you are a seeing is believing kinda guy then you must believe there is short people. I bet you have "Short People" imbedded on the brain, or is it embedded on the brain, lol.

They got little hands
And little eyes
And they walk around
Tellin' great big lies
They got little noses
And tiny little teeth
They wear platform shoes
On their nasty little feet

How ironic.

I've never gone through life not thinking. Is there a switch that gets thrown that takes a person from average everyday thinking to this mystical level of thought?

Or always was.

People can't even grasp the physical -time, space, etc.- how do you think they can even begin to comprehend the spiritual?

There are some who are subject to the understanding that if they can't comprehend or see something, it can't be true.

*Brief side-note for the Christians before I dive in to what I really want to say: The Bible begins with two creation narratives, neither of which begins with "nothing". The first begins with God's spirit over dark abysmal water and the second with a dry parched desert. I don't think this addresses the something from nothing debate...

For what it's worth, and even though it may frustrate some of my fellow Christians, James and Danny are thinking logically (seems to me they usually do). There's no need to think they are uninformed or unintelligent. Humans do not have any way to prove or disprove any theories about the ultimate origin of the universe. They've looked at the evidence and come to one conclusion, other people come to other conclusions. It's fun to discuss, but the bottom line is that nobody can be 100% certain. This leads me to think there are only two options that people have on this matter: faith (in an explanation of any kind - "religious" or "scientific" - both have limits) or agnosticism. Either you can't know, but you are willing to commit to a system of belief anyway, or you can't know, so you are unwilling to commit to any system of belief. This, I think, is the most basic dichotomy there is when it comes to philosophical knowledge of the ultimate origin and meaning of the universe (rather than Christian vs. non-Christian or theist vs. atheist). However, boots-on-the-ground, everyone operates within a basic working theory of the nature of existence. We all have some sense of how we got to where we are; we have some ideas about what is right and wrong; we all have a sense that there are things in the world that are not good, so we do the things we think will decrease the bad and increase the good. I think this is an innate property that humans have, I also think it constitutes a system of belief even if it does not address the ultimate questions. This is where I disagree with James about the definition of religion. James's definition seems to be merely a belief in the supernatural, and I think that's a fairly standard understanding of religion in our culture. Fair enough. However, I think we could define religion like this: any system of belief that results in practice and ritual. Maybe that's too broad for some of you, but I think it's fair too. It acknowledges that we all are ultimately ignorant, but we all find ways to explain our lives anyway, and our explanations determine what we do and how we act.

Thus, even if our belief system doesn't address the ultimate, we still live out of practical religions. Religious systems (under my definition) that don't work out the cosmic/ultimate issues still ascribe cosmic/ultimate value to something (this is called worship). They just give that ultimate value to something less cosmic - perhaps the self (the ultimate goal being to maximize pleasure and minimize pain for myself and ultimate sin/injustice is any pain or limitation that is place on me). Another common option is to give ultimate value to a political system or ideology. Here the bad guys are the ones who disagree with our political ideas, and they must be eliminated or converted so that we can have a good world. This one is super-common nowadays. It's why people like James and Blaine County get so much flak around here. They don't worship the same god as the politically religious here do. Rather than engaging in thoughtful discussion, dissenters are demonized and cast out because they do not worship what is (obviously) ultimately and universally good.

Anyway, I was hoping to say more about magic, but I'm running out of time. Maybe I'll do it later if the conversation is still going. For now, I'll just say that the videos on magic and angels/demons seems to be working with a late medieval understanding of magic and religion. I consider myself a Christian, and, therefore, I try to use the Bible as the ultimate reference for these kinds of questions. Many of the ideas presented, though popular in our cultural understanding of "Christian religion", aren't really Biblical ideas. Or if they are Biblical ideas, they are viewed through a lens that is a medieval version of greco-roman philosophy when they ought to be viewed in an ancient Jewish context. There's more to discuss especially as it relates to Clarke's third law...

The Bible in Genesis 1 says that " in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
The Hebrew word for created is Bara. It means basically that God created what he created from nothing.

Yes if there were limits to or how God created something he wouldn't be God

Pondering the origin of God or debating the existence defeats the purpose of faith. Every man walking agnostic or religious knows that something created this wondrous place we call Earth

And the bible says that every man is without excuse being able to see

Romans 1:16-22 KJV
For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. [17] For therein is the righteousness of God revealed from faith to faith: as it is written, The just shall live by faith. [18] For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who hold the truth in unrighteousness; [19] Because that which may be known of God is manifest in them; for God hath shewed it unto them. [20] For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse: [21] Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. [22] Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,

Verse 20 clearly teaches that creation is understood by the things that are made even his eternal godhead. So everyone that chooses not to believe in God is without excuse when they end up in H3||

Interesting take.

What happens when the world gets so backwards that what one person thinks is bad, others think is good, and vice versa? That is where we are now.

^^^^^
Isaiah 5:20 Woe to those who call evil good and good evil,...

God allows people to lose their minds.

Romans chapter 1
21 For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like a mortal human being and birds and animals and reptiles.

24 Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25 They exchanged the truth about God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.

26 Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural sexual relations for unnatural ones. 27 In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed shameful acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their error.

28 Furthermore, just as they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, so God gave them over to a depraved mind, so that they do what ought not to be done.

Good question! I think this is actually one of the central questions that the Bible is trying to teach us about. Yes, it's where we are now, but it's where we've been forever. Reading the Old Testament will show you that, but, as waggler pointed out (thank you, sir), Paul summarizes it well in the beginning of his letter to the Romans. Although, I think I would have begun quoting at verse 18: "The wrath of God is revealed from Heaven against all ungodliness (the Greek asebeia means irreverence, not sinfulness - it means not giving ultimate honor to what actually deserves it - it's idolatry) and unrighteousness (this is sin - when you mess up the world as a result of the aforementioned idolatry). Contrary to what you may hear about the Christian story, the primary problem with our world is not sin. It's idolatry. It's giving ultimate value, authority, and allegiance to anything that is not God. Sin is the result of idolatry. Our worship of things that are less than God gives those things power over us, and our sin holds us enslaved to those powers - and makes us agents of those powers. The purpose of human life in the Christian worldview is to be agents of God; that's what it would mean to be a true human. Idolatry means we are unable to fulfill our vocational role, that we are enslaved to foreign powers, and that we become something less than human. The end goal of Christian life then isn't "going to Heaven when you die" but being an agent of Heaven on Earth now. This happens through the forgiveness of sins so that we can cast away our idols and become true image-of-God human beings. I'm getting preachy, and I could go on for a while. I will if provoked (so watch out!), but I won't right now. Your Bible tells the story.

No new thing under the sun

Um. Jesus did say that he calls his followers friends. It's not an either/ or.

Classic mistake: assuming an eternal being had a beginning.

I dont think time is linear

Amen

The term from everlasting to everlasting rings a bell

Do you believe in the special theory of relativity then Danny?

We wrap our world view in what we are familiar with...

You mean the catholic cult? Lol

They do exist. Chuck Norris eats them because he likes his steak rare.

Kind of like 5 times 0 is still zero.