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#919351 - 10/07/08 09:23 AM CANINES - Guiding, where do you draw the line?
Tony Dutmers Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/02/08
Posts: 1060
Loc: Mount Pleasant, MI
Guiding can be a good thing when trapping canines, but if used in the wrong manor it can become a tool for discouragement. How far do you take your guiding when targeting fox and coyotes, and are there any techniques you've found to compensate for loud obnoxious guiding features?
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I'M THE MAD TRAPPER THAT NIGHTMARES ON RAT RIVER ARE MADE OF

Set simple & set often...you'll catch fur. Common sense on the traplines goes a long way.

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#919396 - 10/07/08 09:53 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: Tony Dutmers]
Asa Lenon Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 5935
Loc: Gulliver, Michigan
I guess that keeping sets looking reasonably natural and not trying to croud wary canines is what matters for maximum results. Personally, I use moderate step down hole sets and also use sand ridges along side of teach jaw so that the animals has to step down into the lowest point between the sand ridges to better investigate the hole. I also pile up a small dirt pile right in front of the hole. Should the cnaine miss the trap pan when it steps down the small pile of dirt right in front of the hole ensures that they take at least one more step forward to see over the dirt pile. Providing they are natural to the surroundings, I sometimes I take two dead weathered sticks about pencil sized in diameter and about 18" long and plant them firmly up tight against each jaw and leaning outward away from the trap at a 45 or so degree angle to be sure the animal steps in between them. After planting the sticks I take a look and if it doesn't appear natural enough to suit me I pull them back out and go without them. When I instructed students I rarely showed them the guide stick idea as some students just couldn't seem to grasp the idea of natural. At post and blind scent sets I never use sand ridges and seldom use the sticks but rather use more subtle stepping guides like a pebble, hardpan, rotted wood, a turd or whatever is natural and at hand. Asa

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#919416 - 10/07/08 10:10 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: Asa Lenon]
Palerider Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 719
Loc: Mo.
I do much the same as Asa mention.At dirt holes I'll pull the dirt out in a pile,much the same as a coyote or fox will do when digging.


Many,many times I've studied where coyotes and foxes(back when we had them) would dig out a mouse house or a bees nest.I use this ridge of dirt for a guide on one side of the trap.If I feel addition guiding is needed,some times I use a chunk of bees nest just almost touching the opposite jaw of the ridge of dirt coming from the hole.

I also use a lot of double dirt holes which have their own form of guiding.Sometimes I'll also take the edge of my trowel and make three or four deep scratches in the gound which will also act as guiding.

Another way I've used is to take a trap stake and make a small series of small holes that will also act as guides.There are many ,many ways to guide in a suttle way.Only limited by you imagination.

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#919438 - 10/07/08 10:23 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: Palerider]
CharlesKS Offline


Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 11447
Loc: Kansas,32,6-1,220,B/B NS
as far as ill go with guiding coyotes is placing a loose jaw blocking to make a wlakthrough.

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#919448 - 10/07/08 10:28 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: CharlesKS]
boyswannatrap Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/27/06
Posts: 2368
Loc: NY
Originally Posted By: CharlesKS
as far as ill go with guiding coyotes is placing a loose jaw blocking to make a wlakthrough.



Alla Mr. Graham?

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#919451 - 10/07/08 10:29 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: boyswannatrap]
CharlesKS Offline


Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 11447
Loc: Kansas,32,6-1,220,B/B NS
yup.

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#919454 - 10/07/08 10:30 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: CharlesKS]
boyswannatrap Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/27/06
Posts: 2368
Loc: NY
Roger dat.

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#919466 - 10/07/08 10:33 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: boyswannatrap]
j morris Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 3680
Loc: Clearwater, KS
The best guiding you can do is a step down.

Coyotes aren't as bright as made out to be. If they want to work your set they will. Whether it's a flat or a heavily blocked flashy cat sets.

Coyotes are harder on big flashy cat sets than possums. LOL

Charles, I can't find the loose jaw on my traps. Which one is that again?
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"I stop putting catchy phrases in my signature because too many of you morons keep stealing them to put on your facebook pages....."


Jerry Morris

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#919468 - 10/07/08 10:34 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: j morris]
CharlesKS Offline


Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 11447
Loc: Kansas,32,6-1,220,B/B NS
smart [Please excuse my language... I'm an idiot].

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#919470 - 10/07/08 10:35 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: CharlesKS]
CharlesKS Offline


Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 11447
Loc: Kansas,32,6-1,220,B/B NS
loose jaw, OUTSIDE...all the same. you can figure it out.

grin

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#919481 - 10/07/08 10:42 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: CharlesKS]
k. miller Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/04/07
Posts: 6052
Loc: Greensburg, KS 3 blocks from t...
jerry... if u wanna find out about "loose jaws" just ask a woman!
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take me to where the blacktop ends.. then go further with me

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#919555 - 10/07/08 11:19 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: k. miller]
j morris Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 3680
Loc: Clearwater, KS
Been out in the garage looking, all my jaws are TIGHT. None are loose. What kinda POS traps you all run? LOL I think if mine had loose jaws, I'd sell them and buy new.
_________________________
"I stop putting catchy phrases in my signature because too many of you morons keep stealing them to put on your facebook pages....."


Jerry Morris

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#919556 - 10/07/08 11:19 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: j morris]
CharlesKS Offline


Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 11447
Loc: Kansas,32,6-1,220,B/B NS
sigh.

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#919604 - 10/07/08 11:53 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: CharlesKS]
MNcooner Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/20/07
Posts: 3359
Loc: MN, just north of Sodom
J Morris is a hypocrite.

from the trap shed

QUOTE J MORRIS:

"Possible trades for dogproofs or other traps. Trades that will peak my interest are MB750's, Bridger #5's, Griz's, Yancy's DP's, possibly #5 longsprings, factory cabled superstakes, MB550's, possibly good strong 1.5 coils...."

Er... a few of those are POS LOOSE JAW TRAPS. laugh
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Follower of the gnome


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#919609 - 10/07/08 11:56 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: MNcooner]
j morris Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 3680
Loc: Clearwater, KS
Man, I wished I would have known them were inferior POS traps! Should have done my homework a little better. I am gonna have to edit my post to something like "All jaws must be tight and NO traps that the jaws are loose."

Will that work?
_________________________
"I stop putting catchy phrases in my signature because too many of you morons keep stealing them to put on your facebook pages....."


Jerry Morris

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#919610 - 10/07/08 11:57 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: j morris]
j morris Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 3680
Loc: Clearwater, KS
Quit bagging on me MN, all I wants to do is catch a kiotee...
_________________________
"I stop putting catchy phrases in my signature because too many of you morons keep stealing them to put on your facebook pages....."


Jerry Morris

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#919612 - 10/07/08 11:58 AM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: j morris]
MNcooner Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/20/07
Posts: 3359
Loc: MN, just north of Sodom
Sigh.

Some of us poor boyz have to settle for those pos loose jaw traps to catch KIOTEES.

You have any you need to get rid of because they are contaminating your "good" traps you just send 'em my way.
_________________________
Devoted Grubstake disciple

Follower of the gnome


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#919635 - 10/07/08 12:28 PM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: MNcooner]
JimVerdier Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 761
Loc: Scotland , Pa
Im with Charles on this one. Stepdown and loosejaw guard which I prefer to be a turd in most cases.Very subtle stepdowns anymore along the lines of a Charlie Robbins style crossed with a John Ehn and alittle side flavoring added. cool
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"Those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

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#919734 - 10/07/08 01:37 PM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: JimVerdier]
Walleyemike Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/12/07
Posts: 205
Loc: NW L.P. MI
Asa is right on here. My 1st set with this type of step down I made to look like he states but I used some small 1" inch long sticks stuck in the ground behind the pan and jaws in the blended area to make this area uncomfortable to step and guide the foot onto the jaws. I try to make my step downs look alot like the freshly made badger holes in my area and it works good.

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#920162 - 10/07/08 06:07 PM Re: Guiding Canines- where do you draw the line? [Re: Walleyemike]
Tony Dutmers Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/02/08
Posts: 1060
Loc: Mount Pleasant, MI
When I was younger I was inclined to believe that I could force a canine over my trap by constructing loud V-shaped formations from dirt and sticks and such, but I soon discovered that this actually deters canines from working the set. And like Asa said, step-downs are a wonderfull technique here.
_________________________
I'M THE MAD TRAPPER THAT NIGHTMARES ON RAT RIVER ARE MADE OF

Set simple & set often...you'll catch fur. Common sense on the traplines goes a long way.

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