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Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: DiggerDale] #5405678
02/07/16 04:24 PM
02/07/16 04:24 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
trapper
pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
Lots of people, maybe most, call them Victor Jumps. That don't alter the fact that neither O.C. or A.T.C. made a Victor Jump trap. I just wanted to get it out there so that people that hadn't given it much (if any) thought would know that they never made a Victor Jump.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: fiftynine] #5405723
02/07/16 04:47 PM
02/07/16 04:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
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pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
Fiftynine must not have read where i said what i thought the V stood for. I thought i did a pretty good explaining what, in my opinion, the V stood for. As i said, i don't know for sure what it stands for, but i am 100% sure it don't stand for Victor. Its an Oneida Jump, and not a Victor. It cant be both. Look in any O.C. of A.T. C. trap advertisement and you will never see an Oneida Jump Victor advertised. If they made an Oneida Jump Victor, why not a Newhouse Victor, Hawley & Norton Victor, All steel Victor? Because each is a brand of traps and each stand on its own.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5406216
02/07/16 09:41 PM
02/07/16 09:41 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 34
Ontario
M
mushrat Offline
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mushrat  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 34
Ontario
Pineywoods, I think it great that veteran collectors such as yourself can derive these theories as to the why, how, and when certain things happen in history and how it can alter the processes along the way. I think that is why there has been so much written about the history of the steel trap, but unfortunately a great deal of information has been lost or altered over time. I do find it a little odd that you pass negative feedback about the new trap collectors guide, on the premise of unclaimed information. Not to belittle your knowledge, but I would think that when a list of contributors such as: Parr,Andreski,Clark, Cords, Delavan, Dahms, Gipe, Harrison, Hamzy,Kelly,Langert, Lamontange, Lefebvre, Munro, Nohle, Precht, Stewart,and some other well known and respected collectors compile information and theories most of us are not going to argue with and treat it as theories and accept it as such not facts. Personally i think it is a great book I wouldn't say that I agree with everything as far as pricing goes but its the best I can find out there. Hats off to those fellows involved I can imagine they took some heat along the way I don't imagine all collectors can agree on values and Im sure they have heard about it.
Regards,

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: mushrat] #5406287
02/07/16 10:17 PM
02/07/16 10:17 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
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pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
Mushrat You misunderstood what i said. The ones you named have been collecting traps for a long time. I think MOST of them try to get what they write correct. But not all of them. Anyway i wasn't talking about any of the Guys you mentioned. In fact i don't know who wrote the articles. If you will look, you will find articles on "what i consider off the wall" history of traps. No one claims these articles. If they won't say where they got there information. then they shouldn't print it. I know for a fact that some of the unclaimed articles are not correct, so the ones i don't know about, i don't know if i should believe them or not.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5406868
02/08/16 10:42 AM
02/08/16 10:42 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 66
Indiana
B
bigmac2 Offline
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bigmac2  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 66
Indiana
Well said mushrat.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: mushrat] #5406911
02/08/16 11:20 AM
02/08/16 11:20 AM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 483
Huntingburg, In.
N
No.4 Offline
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No.4  Offline
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N

Joined: May 2011
Posts: 483
Huntingburg, In.
Originally Posted By: mushrat
Pineywoods, I think it great that veteran collectors such as yourself can derive these theories as to the why, how, and when certain things happen in history and how it can alter the processes along the way. I think that is why there has been so much written about the history of the steel trap, but unfortunately a great deal of information has been lost or altered over time. I do find it a little odd that you pass negative feedback about the new trap collectors guide, on the premise of unclaimed information. Not to belittle your knowledge, but I would think that when a list of contributors such as: Parr,Andreski,Clark, Cords, Delavan, Dahms, Gipe, Harrison, Hamzy,Kelly,Langert, Lamontange, Lefebvre, Munro, Nohle, Precht, Stewart,and some other well known and respected collectors compile information and theories most of us are not going to argue with and treat it as theories and accept it as such not facts. Personally i think it is a great book I wouldn't say that I agree with everything as far as pricing goes but its the best I can find out there. Hats off to those fellows involved I can imagine they took some heat along the way I don't imagine all collectors can agree on values and Im sure they have heard about it.
Regards,


Dang, Mushrat! Where are you when the books by Robert Vance/Ed Hutzel, men with a combined trap collecting, trap anything, related knowledge of close to one hundred years, are being trashed? whistle frown






Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5407238
02/08/16 03:35 PM
02/08/16 03:35 PM
Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 834
NE NE
W
Wife Offline
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Wife  Offline
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W

Joined: Aug 2015
Posts: 834
NE NE
Don't grind the teeth. Remove entire Jaws and offer a trade for regular jaws. If no one else close to you, I have some reg. jaws and will trade.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5407309
02/08/16 04:26 PM
02/08/16 04:26 PM
Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 497
PA
P
pick65 Offline
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pick65  Offline
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Joined: Aug 2011
Posts: 497
PA
Don't grind the teeth. Remove entire Jaws and offer a trade for regular jaws. If no one else close to you, I have some reg. jaws and will trade.

Wow, at first I though that you were talking about your personal teeth,
than I realized your were talking about teeth on the trap. grin

pick65

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: mushrat] #5407670
02/08/16 08:47 PM
02/08/16 08:47 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
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pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
By the way Mushrat, did you get help writing this post? It sounds exactly like what someone i know would have written.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5407721
02/08/16 09:00 PM
02/08/16 09:00 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 241
Northern Mn.
peaver Offline
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peaver  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 241
Northern Mn.
piney I have a trap with a v cut out and says victor on the pan...it is a jump trap inside a long....no 41....

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5407733
02/08/16 09:03 PM
02/08/16 09:03 PM
Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 241
Northern Mn.
peaver Offline
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peaver  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2016
Posts: 241
Northern Mn.
some of the 14s were made with no 4 pans...then a no 1 was hand stamped next to the 4 to make them 15s....maybe this one got missed...

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: peaver] #5407764
02/08/16 09:15 PM
02/08/16 09:15 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
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pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
Peaver, its an underspring, but does it jump??? Does it say both Oneida Jump & Victor, or just Victor.

Last edited by pineywoods; 02/08/16 10:13 PM.
Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: peaver] #5407808
02/08/16 09:29 PM
02/08/16 09:29 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
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pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
Lots of things i haven't seen, but i don't remember seeing a hand stamped one on a #14. I did know a Guy in Alaska back in the early 1970's that ordered some #14 jaws and put them in #4 Jump traps.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5407814
02/08/16 09:33 PM
02/08/16 09:33 PM
Joined: May 2011
Posts: 483
Huntingburg, In.
N
No.4 Offline
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No.4  Offline
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Joined: May 2011
Posts: 483
Huntingburg, In.
I've got an Oneida #14 jump w-hand stamped 1.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5407838
02/08/16 09:42 PM
02/08/16 09:42 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,353
North Cass Co. Minnesota
DiggerDale Offline
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DiggerDale  Offline
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,353
North Cass Co. Minnesota
I thought all the 14 jumps had the 1 hand stamped. I think some newhouse ATC 14s came that way too. Or maybe I've been buying from some shady characters....

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: DiggerDale] #5407929
02/08/16 10:18 PM
02/08/16 10:18 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
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pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
Surely, DiggerDale doesn't think that the O.C. and latter A.T.C. had workers hand stamping a #1 on a #4 jump pan to make a #14 jump for 70+ years. Also the #4 Newhouse with offset jaws go back to at least 1865. In 1887 they changed it from #4 with offset jaws to #14. IF any #14's left the factory with a hand stamped #1 it would have been that year. If so, the mold mark will be on the underside of the jaws close to the center and not on the leg of the jaws. It is highly unlikely that an A.T.C. 14 left the factory with the #1 hand stamped in.

Last edited by pineywoods; 02/09/16 12:31 AM.
Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5407963
02/08/16 10:28 PM
02/08/16 10:28 PM
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 34
Ontario
M
mushrat Offline
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mushrat  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 34
Ontario
Pineywoods , I had no help writing it. And unfortunately I guess I can't prove it to you either.....

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: mushrat] #5408045
02/08/16 11:07 PM
02/08/16 11:07 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
P
pineywoods Offline
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pineywoods  Offline
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Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 44
texas
mushrat, You don't have to prove anything to me. I take a man at his word until he proves that it is no good.

Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5408243
02/09/16 01:39 AM
02/09/16 01:39 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 57
Fishhook, Alaska
F
fiftynine Offline
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fiftynine  Offline
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Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 57
Fishhook, Alaska
Pineywoods must not have read where I said ...

"Doesn't explain the v on the pan but interesting history about Oneida Community"

Last edited by fiftynine; 02/09/16 03:24 AM.
Re: Victor #4 Jump with teeth [Re: Coonriver] #5408266
02/09/16 03:16 AM
02/09/16 03:16 AM
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 57
Fishhook, Alaska
F
fiftynine Offline
trapper
fiftynine  Offline
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F

Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 57
Fishhook, Alaska
The Oneida Community, Ltd. expanded from game traps into mouse traps with the acquisition of the Animal Trap Company of Lititz, Pennsylvania, in 1906. Thereafter, the classic wooden snap traps for small rodents became Victors of the Oneida Community, Ltd. - See more at: http://www.trapperpredatorcaller.com/art...h.jaRhfgfG.dpuf

I always thought ATC bought out Oneida Community, but not according to this. Hey coonriver, 5 years ago I bought a bunch of 14 Oneida Jump V for victor victory varmint viva traps with the teeth ground off at a trappers rondy in Fenner, NY for $5 each. If they had the teeth they'd be worth what wiss miss said $15 to 25.

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