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#2319353 - 12/22/10 11:55 AM Under ice beaver/conibear?
TrapperTy Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 62
Loc: Alaska
Has anybody tried this beaver set? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ddh3rynNg7s&feature=player_embedded It looks like an easy way to trap beaver under the ice. I doesn't look like the trap would have very much stability. I prefer snaring for beavers but my sets require a little more work than this set. It looks like you could just auger a few 10 inch holes then drop the trap in.

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#2319381 - 12/22/10 12:18 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
Yes I have had some success with that type of set.
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#2319520 - 12/22/10 01:53 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: white17]
TrapperTy Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/03/07
Posts: 62
Loc: Alaska
Thanks. I was planning to set some beaver lodges this evening and I was looking for conibear type sets. This video was in my email from Trapper Predator Caller. I'll give it a try.

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#2319532 - 12/22/10 02:10 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
I also had good luck just attaching a short piece of white PVC to the trigger wires on the 330. Just drill two holes in the pipe, run the wires through, and bend them slightly. That way you don't lose the pipe when the trap fires
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#2320206 - 12/22/10 08:24 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: white17]
watarrat Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/04/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Lake Iliamna Ak
W17 Is the pvc simulating a bait??

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#2320231 - 12/22/10 08:29 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
Yes. Looks like a peeled stick or something edible to them I guess
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#2320255 - 12/22/10 08:37 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
Caught my first two beaver that way. It does work..not sure about the pvc though. However I am going to try it. Apple, aspen, popular all will work.

Good luck

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#2320275 - 12/22/10 08:45 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
Results;

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#2320294 - 12/22/10 08:49 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
watarrat Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/04/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Lake Iliamna Ak
Looks good!! We will be the Iliamna field testers soon,my bride is in the moose hunting mode now. Thanks White!

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#2320327 - 12/22/10 08:58 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
You bet! Good luck !


By the way, I don't hang mine the way the video showed it. I just have a piece of cable attached to one spring eye and drop it straight down the hole. I run that cable up to a stick across the hole. Also, I put them a couple feet below the bottom of the ice so they don't freeze in. That guy in the video wasn't working with much ice there.
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#2320360 - 12/22/10 09:12 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
Just to add another option to this.

I never liked the idea of the swinging 330 under the ice. Just seemed to have a bigger margin of error to me so I use a straight dead pole through both springs and run it down into the bottom with the trap hanging off the side of it. Then either bait the trigger or the jaw. It works really well for me.

That said I don't doubt the swing trap works I never tried it because in my mind I did not like it.



Edited by Brandon Yuchasz (12/22/10 09:25 PM)

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#2320373 - 12/22/10 09:19 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
Yep I've used the pole also. I don't like it though because you have to thread that set trap down on the pole, through the spring eyes. Also, if you are in deep water you have to pull up a long pole and the trap has to go up in the air and it might have a beaver in it. Just awkward and maybe a bit risky IMO. It does seem more stable though the beaver don't seem to mind the swinging trap.

Another thing nice about this set is that you can use old, weak 330's that you wouldn't trust on dry land.
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#2320387 - 12/22/10 09:23 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Brandon Yuchasz]
mad_mike Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/01/08
Posts: 174
Loc: Podunk, Alaska
I am also in question about the swinging 330 under the ice. It seems odd to me to not have a trap be that unstable. We go though such efforts to make both legholds and connibear type traps solid in their set position. Am I missing something magical about this type of set?


Edited by mad_mike (12/22/10 09:24 PM)
Edit Reason: Didn't get enoughbook learning

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#2320420 - 12/22/10 09:35 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
I don't think so. When you think about, the trap is dead still as the beaver approaches. He grabs the "bait" with either his teeth or feet and it fires. Period. They must be used to pieces of brush in their grub pile moving as they cut off a piece to take home so maybe a bit of movement means nothing to them. As long as it works, it doesn't matter to me whether the trap is solid or not.
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#2320433 - 12/22/10 09:42 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
takotna Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/22/06
Posts: 1198
Loc: Takotna AK
Yrs ago a buddy and I caught a mess of beaver the way w17 did with one spring and birch branches wadded up and placed on trigger, for some reason it just don't work anymore and anyway I prefer 2 or 3 snares and a bait pole.

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#2320443 - 12/22/10 09:45 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
I usually put in two holes. One with snares and one with the coni. Especially when it's really cold.
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#2320458 - 12/22/10 09:54 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Kusko Offline
"Mr. Mayor"

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 3768
Loc: Bethel, AK
I didn't watch the whole video, but is it where you wire green sticks to the loose jaw?
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#2320529 - 12/22/10 10:41 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
yukon254 Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/31/08
Posts: 445
Loc: Yukon
I do it like W17 except with a bait stick instead of pvc. works best later in the winter. snares set just under the ice around the feed beds will catch all the beaver you want to skin.
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#2320631 - 12/22/10 11:34 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
I have caught them although I have not done it extensively. Just wanted to see if it would work. The pvc holds the eye appeal. Baits sticks go gray pretty fast.


Edited by Family Trapper (12/22/10 11:35 PM)
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#2320687 - 12/23/10 12:34 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
madtrapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/06
Posts: 2151
Loc: Ely, Minnesota, coolest small ...
Yes, I have caught beaver this way, I think the thing about the swinging trap is that the beaver does not have a dead pull which can cause rubs on the fur more than a trap that is not anchored solidly.


Edited by madtrapper (12/29/10 10:40 PM)
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Ely, Minnesota, coolest small town in America, 2010.

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#2320711 - 12/23/10 02:00 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
elanman Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 5
Loc: big lake, Alaska
beaver round me would think that white pvc was some fresh birch i'm thinking. i will be trying different forms of this next month and a half..usually i'm a snare down a hole with bogs of fresh small birch branches kinda guy. but anxious to try this swinging 330 set.

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#2320715 - 12/23/10 02:16 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Big finn Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 17
Loc: up of michigan
I've caught alot of beaver in snares ,330 den enterences, baited footholds and on and on,but when the ice gets thick the best way is 330 baited with a couple small poplar sticks attached to the spring ,not the trigger, bait on the bottem, trigger just above the bait.Useing the swinging set,I have few misses the beaver moves in going forward grabs the bait continues to swim forward and finds himself square in the trap.I,m sure the pvc is good to but I would't put it on the trigger but on the lower spring loop.

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#2325829 - 12/25/10 04:21 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
madtrapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/06
Posts: 2151
Loc: Ely, Minnesota, coolest small ...
Spring loop? You mean the lower bar?
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Ely, Minnesota, coolest small town in America, 2010.

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#2325945 - 12/25/10 05:41 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Big fin would it looks something like this? I actually turned the one trip wire outward on both sides to help them tripping it on arrival.




On my otter traps and beaver bait sets that might not get hit regularly I have fun putting electric wires on them. I cover and insulate well to keep the ice picking to a min. The trap when fires breaks the continuity on the wire that sticks up above my insulation and makes for a quick check.


This set I had high hopes for. However it did not produce. I like the visibility of the white plastic bags as they stayed nice and white and were easy to apply. Can't help but think it would work elsewhere. I would love some critique on this set. Usually it is set the same way but with the cottonwood scraped up white in the same place. Snares have just been a hit and miss deal for me under the ice compared to conibears.






Edited by Family Trapper (12/25/10 05:43 PM)
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Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2326046 - 12/25/10 06:43 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Big finn Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 17
Loc: up of michigan
Well kinda I only hang the trap by one spring and the bait tied to the spring but still between the jaws on the loop witch closses the jaws.I'll be gettin after some beaver later in the winter and will try that snare set looks good to me.Some of my ponds have really dark water and I like the bag idea. Oh yea anouther thing dont just lay the cross stick on the ice, build it up some or flag them somehow a little snow or overflow and there hard to find sometimes.

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#2326420 - 12/25/10 08:57 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Big finn]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Quote:
Oh yea anouther thing dont just lay the cross stick on the ice, build it up some or flag them somehow a little snow or overflow and there hard to find sometimes.

That never happens to me. laugh cry cry

Now where was that set?



Nope maybe over here.



Man I worked for that one.
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2326866 - 12/26/10 07:33 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Big finn Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 17
Loc: up of michigan
LOL somehow that looks familliar..

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#2327000 - 12/26/10 09:29 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Big finn]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
I don't use coni's much under the ice. snares are so much easierwhen trapping under ice. but i did take one this year with a Belisle 330. Hung it off both springs with wire. a real narrow exit where they were coming out from under the ice to cut feedwood. I've used the swinging 330 set now and then and see no problems. I usually set the trigger to the side a bit so as to have them a little deeper into the trap when it springs.
The one foot catch is a bit of a mystery as the set was tight against two rocks and not much water. Still he must have tried to go around. Good ole Belisles! .






Edited by Hornhunter (12/26/10 09:32 AM)

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#2327022 - 12/26/10 09:41 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
Good idea on painting the ax a bright color. That's one reason I carry two.
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Mean As Nails

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#2327253 - 12/26/10 11:43 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
takotna Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/22/06
Posts: 1198
Loc: Takotna AK
A guy don't want to "squeeze" the beaver through the hole useing conni's, a buddy and I got one by the tail and it slipped off, the buddy grabbed it as it was going back down and we took turns holding it under water while the other picked the whole bigger, fun fun fun!!

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#2328161 - 12/26/10 06:48 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: takotna]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
Quote:
Good idea on painting the ax a bright color

If it would help me find my glasses I'd paint them orange as well.

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#2328290 - 12/26/10 07:41 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
I hear ya !
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#2328929 - 12/27/10 05:12 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Horn hunter what percent of you sets like this produce vs get pulled out. Is you upright tree the bait is on live or dead? I have mixed luck using similar with more pull outs than I care for.
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Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2329168 - 12/27/10 09:07 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Family Trapper]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
Quote:
I have mixed luck using similar with more pull outs than I care for

(Pull outs verse knocked down snares) I went back and forth trying different sized cable, locks. loop size, and cable type-1x19-and 7x7. I had settled on 1x16th -1x19 thinking the stiffer cable would hold a better loop and give a better chance of a beaver getting in the loop. I had numerous pull out. Cable out straight with the lock closed,-"Till" I listened to a local long line trapper Jerry Braley who uses alot of snares, and even catches many otter in these beaver snares. He uses nothing but the 7x7-1/16th cable, and the 1/16 th Cam Loc. (Made from a 42 inch cable)He mentioned catching beaver by the toes. That was something I hadn't done. (Had Caught them by the front foot, teeth, nose,tail, but never the toes)
For sure I have nocked down snares, now that I use his type of snare, but very few have the lock closed tight.
I checked one set up yesterday and had two small beaver out of 4 sets. The first set was up abainst a bank with the feed pile on the other side. Both these snares were knocked down, I think? the beaver traveling down to the dam, or around the pile ran the bottom and hit the snares but were too low to get caught ( About 2-1/2-3ft of water).I added two snares under the first set. --Maybe I'll have 4 knocked down to reset next time?
One of those small beaver was on a like set with two layers of snares and did get caught In the bottom two snares. We have to be 10ft from a beaver house here, and It's possible he was coming out of the house and hit the loop.
Darcy Alkerton a well known Canadian trapper uses 1x19 cable. He catches a pile of beaver in snares. He used to post on trapperman, Not sure if he still does.

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#2329217 - 12/27/10 09:37 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
cat catcher Online   content
trapper

Registered: 10/26/09
Posts: 80
Loc: Atlin, British Columbia Canada
i am by no means an expert but i set 2 layers of snares in between the top and bottom set of snares i put a 14" dead branch this aids in holding up the bottom snare. also diverts them i think.i had my best luck and less knocked down snares with this

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#2331895 - 12/28/10 12:50 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: cat catcher]
Mainiac Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/02/07
Posts: 155
Loc: Princeton, Maine
I think the baited conibear is my least favorite underice set. Conibears are best suited for runs. We use snares and footholds for baited sets. We also have tried all the cables and the 7X7 1/16th seems to be the best. We use mostly cam locks but the microlock has performed well. I would think you alaskans would use footholds under ice. They are deadly. Here are a few pics of the setup. Some of you may have seen these before.

Quaking aspen is our preferred bait. Top of bait is only 6 inches under the ice. All beaver caught by left foot. I think they press their back on the ice to work the bait. The stand or "chair" holding the 14 also provides eye apeal. My trapping partner can make this set as quick as I can make a snare set. He has caught thousands of beaver with this set. Also uses the 14 on a leaning pole with aspen brush for bait. I will try and find some pics.




the backing pole so they wont work the set from the rear.

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#2331962 - 12/28/10 01:22 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Rally Hess is a pretty prominent beaver trapper on here and I think that is just what he said to me. He is really great to talk to if you want info on beaver snaring. He said Go limber on the 7by 7 and you will start picking up a lot more incidental catches, feet, tails that would be a miss a lot of times. I am going to steer him on to this thread as I think he could bring some valuable info.
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Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2331969 - 12/28/10 01:26 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
Foot holds just look like a lot of fooling around to me. Especially with thick ice, a guy would have to get the angle just right and usually it's not possible to see that far into the water. I've never tried it though.
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#2332008 - 12/28/10 01:55 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
chessielover Offline
trapper

Registered: 06/03/09
Posts: 172
Loc: lk louise Ak
Back in WI we would use a larger support with a notch to put the spring end in with bait above. Worked well but didn't have to deal with 2 feet or more of ice or overflow.

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#2332012 - 12/28/10 01:59 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Pittu Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/09/07
Posts: 895
Loc: Alaska
Speaking of overflow, I spent 2 hours chipping overflow with an ax to atone for the bright idea to place a blind trail set on river ice....

Interesting ideas on the baited coni's...thanks alot guys, gives me some ideas for a feed pile I've been eyeing....

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#2332994 - 12/28/10 09:03 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
Nice looking set John.

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#2333155 - 12/28/10 10:07 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
alaska viking Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/25/07
Posts: 1825
Loc: juneau, alaska
How much for that trap?
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Carl Sagan.

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#2333656 - 12/29/10 07:20 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: alaska viking]
Mainiac Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/02/07
Posts: 155
Loc: Princeton, Maine
It really isn't that much "fooling around". The chairs are already built and you don't need to see down through the ice. Just cut a hole and place pole down so bait is about 4-6" from ice and your done. Give it a try, you may like it. We have found lots of sprung traps with baited conibears. We don't want to educate them and why carry conibears for baited sets when snares work just as good and are way lighter? The baited foothold has many versions but this version outperforms all others we have tried. The last batch of 14s were about $18 per.

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#2336081 - 12/30/10 02:16 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.


The above two pictures are the way I normally set my beaver bait poles. Water depth determines how many snares I put per pole and about 1 in 50 poles or so I will put six snares on a pole. It would be just like the four snare pole pictured with two more snares added.
It is really quite rare here to have much over 6' of water (clear water) around a beaver lodge, and most often in the bogs I snare, the bottoms are quite soft (loon poop).
To give you some history on how I came up with these setups, which I call Beaver Spikes, and why I use them. I have been snaring beaver under ice for a little over thirty years, Like everybody else who chops alot of ice and makes alot of snares, I have used alot of lock and cable variations. I've used 1x7, 7x7, and 1x19 cable, and a host of locks. Some were good and some I gave away in frustration.Some I bought in my early years had obviously been built by a person who had never snared beaver under ice.I don't believe in knocking other peoples products and will just tell you what I have come up with and how I got to this point.
In my early years I used primarily 1x19 1/16" cable with a bunch of different locks, as that was what was preached in those days. It was common then, and still is today, to see poles with extensive frame works and multiple snares. They catch beaver, but take big holes to get them in working order, and take more time than I have found necesary. I find it faster for me to put down several poles like pictured above than to put a single frame with multiple snares and bait sticks. Most often when a beaver is caught they knock down most of the snares anyway, particularly a large beaver. I experimented with frame type setups and multiple bait sticks which employed tangle stakes outside the anchor poles with some success but still took way to long to make, but it definately increased my multiple catches.
I used the 1x19 1/16" cable for about 12 years and caught plenty of beaver with it, but noticed some things I thought should be eliminated. I had minor white snare marks on the beaver and found them hard to feel under the ice since the cable and some of the locks I tried were so small. When I check my poles I don't pull the whole pole up unless I catch a beaver. I first wipe the ice clean on one side of the pole and chop a small hole just large enough to get my arm into. I then reach under the ice and feel for my top two snares, to see if they have been knocked down. If I catch a beaver on the bottom they have no trouble knocking down all the snares so I see no advantage to pulling the whole pole to check the bottom snares.
I was doing decent with the 1x19 1/16" cable and even catching a few by the extremities(feet ,nose, tail), but was quite often having my snares pulled down to small loops (like pictured below) and nothing in them. Most often the cable also showed minor kinks in the cable,evidence of a beaver struggling some before getting out. What puzzled me the most was the loops were not always the same size or shape, but most often about a 1.5-2" loop. I was experimenting with different locks and some increased my hit miss ratio, some dramatically over others, but still was having way too many small loops with nothing in them. I was loading all my snares even back then and the weights and angles the locks approached the cable when set was noticeable, and affected the way I shaped the snares and their speed, and the way they fired, hung on the poles,and where I most often caught the beaver on their body. I learned from using snares that weren't loaded early on, that a snare has to be able to move to work and anything the loop came in contact with would slow it's closing or even cause a beaver to be able to completely swim through the loop, maybe just knocking it down with it's tail or back feet as it propells itself around the pole, often with the snare falling partially shut to like a five inch loop. Consider that a live, swimming, beavers body is the consistancy of jello and quite fluid. A snare has to close quickly and move freely. A snare that is not loaded has to be physically pulled shut from the beavers motion to catch it. A back foot catch is most often the result of a beaver swimming completely through your snare and picking the snare up on it's foot on the forward motion as it propells itself around the pole. A loaded snare should only have to be elongated about two inches to activate it, and the lock slides until it hits fur. If the loop encounters anything during it's closing (like the pole, a stub branch,bundle of bait sticks, tips of branches in the feedpile, muskeg, or even an extremity of the beaver)it will hinder its closing.
It finally dawned on me that the 1x19 cable was so stiff that it took a great deal of pressure to cause it to close down to a small enough loop to cature a beaver by the nose or front feet and that the minor kinks were evidence that indeed the loops were just sliding off their front feet and nose, and the ocasional larger elongated loops were from tail catches that were slipping off also. I was also getting tired of trying to feel the smaller cable with the gauntlets on and a pair of wool gloves under those, made it even worse during cold spells. At the time I was also using 5/64" 1x19 for coyotes so tried that next, for a short period of time. It was easier to put back in the hole through some slush, was easier to feel, loaded like lightning, and I had less noticeable marks. In over 500 beaver taken with the 5/64" cable i never had an extremity catch, and was getting quite a few snares pulled down to about a 3" loop and empty. Back to the drawing board!
I didn't want to go to a larger cable, thinking it would be more visable and a deterent to the beaver, so I used 5/64" 7x7.My extremities catches went through the roof, I started catching otter that were playing around my poles regularly, and even caught some muskrats on my poles!!! I was a happy camper for quite awhile, and still use some of it regularly when otter season is open here. It was a little harder to push through slush than the 1x19 had been, but I could cut smaller slots and just get it started down the hole with one hand and I was in business. I cut my slots in the ice with a chainsaw so the sides of the holes are quite smooth when I first set. After that I have to make sure I get them clear of jagged ice on the edges when I first start down after remakes and catches. If I had to choose one cable for all my needs for my way of setting this would be it, but the majority of my beaver season , the otter season is not open.The 7x7 5/64 was as easy to feel as the 1x19 5/64" and the snare marks were not bad, but it is an otters worst nightmare under ice. It loads well, pulls down to nothing with most locks and works well at bank runs / house entrances, where the beaver are traveling faster, and is more subtle and form fitting.
I'm a tinkerer, and can't stand it when I believe I can make something better, that will make my work easier.Snaring beaver under ice falls into that category with all the skinning and chopping. I had been using different support systems on my poles, most being some version of a wire holder with a support collar or the end of the wire crimped to the snare. Then I went to using a cable that went through loops on the anchor end of snares and I fastened it to the bottom of the pole with a fence staple, and the top had an adjustable loop end to put a safety stick above the ice. The safety stick also held my pole in place until it froze in. That system helped get my beaver down the pole where they could wrap up instead of freezing to the bottom of the ice, like the first wired on snares or long snares run down the pole and all anchored above the ice. Then I made the safety cables with a one way drowning locks on them to attach the snares to so the beaver couldn't come back up. All of them worked and each seemed to be an improvement over what I had been using, but still felt like it took too long messing around with a bunch of wire, and I ruined alot of gauntlets by poking holes in them while checking.Then I made a jig that would make what is best described as a long wire swivel, which I bent at a 90 degree angle at the eye of the swivel. I just kept making them longer until I got them to support my snare so that it just cleared the pole. This gave me an eye to put the safety cable through, I could adjust the angle of the snare on the pole by just bending it where I wanted. They lasted for a long time and about the only thing that hurt them much was me hitting them with my chisel while chopping to check.I caught alot of beaver with these too and a buddy of mine is still using them. They were held on the pole with a small fence staple, and the big beaver could always pull them off the pole but sometimes a small beaver would just wrap on the top and often be froze right in the hole. Yep, right were I start chopping at! The staples weren't any fun in real cold either because I couldn't hold the staples while wearing gloves. Back to the drawing board again.
I then reasoned, if I could make a holder that would hold the snare ridgid, just off the pole,had an eye to run the safety cable through,and would fasten easier to the pole, I would have it made. That's when I came up with what I now call the Beaver Bracket. It is a piece of 1/2" flat stock bent into a wide U shape with one side shorter than the other, and another L shaped piece welded into one corner of that U to form a small square.The bracket allows the snare to swivel, is held on the pole with a roofing nail, which is retained with a small cross section of surgical tubing, which allows me to just pound it on the pole, where ever I want, while wearing gloves,has an eye incorporated to run my safety cable through, and stays on the pole long enough to ensure the lock has set when the beaver pulls on it, is tough and can take alot of chiseling LOL. and I even wax and die them for long life.
I'd used these for about 6 years and started selling them to friends. Next thing I know I'm doing the convention circuit and making about fifty different snares.
Over the years I'd caught several otter after season and we have to turn them in to the DNR. I was trying to find a way to eliminate the incidental otter and started using 3/32" 7x7 cable on the brackets. The stiffer cable was easier to feel, pushed through slush easier, left very faint to no snare marks and could often just be reshaped after catching a small beaver or a large one by the nose. My incidental otter catch went to near nothing.When I first started selling the brackets I was using all Reichert reverse bend washers on them for a lock. They are all loaded and quite fast, infact too fast. I had a few customers that reported they were lowering there poles through the ice and having their snares fire.I changed the angle on the bracket and now use the BMI Slide Free lock on all the brackets. They require a little more pressure exerted to the loop to get them started and my customers are reporting good results. I still use some Reicherts on my brackets as you can see in the pictures, I just use a little more finesse when I put them down and I have alot of them still. The bracket kits are $30.00 a kit and can be heavy, when carrying around a hundred or so.I got to playing with some ideas and came up with what is now the beaver spikes. A throw away snare that incorporates a nail, that works somewhat like the bracket. It's been a big hit with the market. It works well, sells for $22.00 a kit,weighs less, and you don't have to make replacement snares for it.It is possible to get over 150, with safety cables, in a square bucket, with a hatchet.A pretty good days work to get that many set. A spud and chainsaw rounds out my equipment needed to set all day.After I have a line established, I carry a snare bag that holds 4 dozen snares and 12 safety cables to check the line.I love traveling light, and that gives me enough for replacements and I can set a couple new colonies every day. That is pretty much how I came up with the snares I use today.


In some of these photos you will see a few beaver , like the one above that were taken with 1x19 1/16" cable on spikes, with both Mini Reichert and BMI Slide Free locks. These were taken three winters ago, for a test of that cable, under ice for the BMP snare study.

This is a picture of my new ride and the under seat tool box. A Ski doo Skandic WT. I can get about 3 dozen snares, safety cables and a set of gauntlets under the seat. That's my idea of traveling light. Only have one season on it but I am pretty impressed so far. I'll let you know what kind of machine it is in about ten years.


The two pictures above are from last season. This is a house on a CCC ditch. A forrester friend of mine asked me to trap it out so they could drain the ditch to access the timber west of it. One picture is facing south the other north, to show how I set it up. If you look to the south(first picture) you can see a dam. The beaver have a dam on both sides of the house and actually changed the direction of the waterflow. The tree line in the far south is the head of this section of ditch. Where my snowmobile is sitting is about 3' of loon poop and very little water. I had to put poles in the runs coming out of the house to have enough water for them to work. Three of the poles only had two snares on them and were about five feet under the ice with only 18" of clear water. I just talked to a customer here in my shop and he had trapped this in the fall and only taken one two year old and a kit with conibears and footholds.I took five with the four poles. in three checks.


A picture of some of my beaver from last year. Note the rats, I think their were 17 there. All but five caught on poles. Also notice the light snare mark on the beaver closest to the camera, taken with 5/64" cable most likely. In the second picture notice the tiny beaver laying on the big beaver. The two size extremes you can encounter and what you are asking a snare to catch. The big one measured 78" and the small one like 41".


The first picture above this is what happens whe a beaver freezes to the bottom of the ice in a shallow water set, combined with a cold snap makes for alot of chopping to get my beaver out with no holes in it. The second picture is of a shallow water set I use. It is a series of three snares in a cloverleaf around the pole. I cut a triangle shaped hole with the chainsaw and put it under the ice, then move the pole over to one of the points of the triangle and set it on the bottom. I use these in areas where I have contracted to remove the beaver and can only access them by snowmobile. The beaver has nowhere to go since the snares are anchored at the top and often freeze to the bottom of the ice.My back was up against a snowmobile bridge when I took these two pictures and the beaver found it made a nice base for a dam.Took 19 beaver out of this flowage within a mile in either direction of this dam.Nothing better than easy access and a groomed trail in the middle.Expect alot of chewed up poles and empty snares with this type system. The reason is the beaver are sitting on the bottom and not swimming around the pole while they chew your pole. The chop marks on the pole will show their body position while they chew it. I use this when I can't locate a bank or house run and a feedpile is obvious.



These two pictures above are of the same beaver, one taken a little closer than the first. It was one I snared with 1x19 1/16" cable and Mini Reichert lock, during that BMP study three winters ago.

This is a picture to give you an idea where I place my poles. This is an odd setup as far as their placement of the feedpile. If you look at the surrounding trees you will notice their isn't much for them to eat. These beaver are living on tag alders and willow. I have four poles at this location, you can only see three in the picture because the one closest to the house and to the right has been pulled completely under the ice. If you also look at the pole closest to the snowmachine you can see it is leaning. I had a double there that day. What is unusual about this house is where the feedpiles are at. They had stack brush on both shores on either side of the house, with two runs coming out of the house about two feet apart.The poles are sitting in the runs or real close to them. Took seven out of that house. This is in a WMA area and this is the main outlet ditch for about 30 square miles. Poor looking beaver area but it would take a semi to haul the beaver out of here that travel this ditch in a year.


This is a picture of the same ditch only a mile farther East.The house is the dark spot to the right in the picture. I had three poles here, the one you can see closet has been partially pulled under water and the second one is leaning. The third pole is around the far side of the house and I never caucght a beaver in it. I had a double there that day and that was the only two beaver there. We had a four day warm spell and that is what caused the overflow. What you can't see in the picture is the amount of feed that these two beaver had aquired. All the way around the house was filled with small tag alder. I had to put poles in the runs because that was the only clean water ereas. I can't imagine how many trips these two beaver must have made to collect all that feed. It was a rather flat feed pile with very little above the water line but the overflow had completely covered it and refroze, or mostly so. Made for an interesting walk to that house and had to kneel on logs to reset. There was also a large house at the treeline, and about a mile farther east was the river these ditches drain into.
[img:gal:111144d1c49252a383]http://www.trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2010/12/full-11114-7663-dscn0686.jpg[/img)
This is a house at the headwaters of the above ditch. If you look to the right in the picture you can see the road grade of the two track that accesses this area. It doesn't look like much, but I have taken at least a pair of beaver out of this house for at least 12 years straight. The beaver just keep patching it up and every year pile the ditch full between the house and road grade. Every year I put a pole on each side of it and just have to park the snowmachine on the road and walk down the road grade. Wish I had about 200 more spots just like it. If you look down the ditch where the single spruce is that is where the dam is usually at. I was making a set there two years ago and a pair of moose crossed the ditch within twenty feet of me. They just looked at my snowmachine and kept on trucking. We don't have many in this area but this particular swamp is a stronghold for them. A young bull got hit about 17 miles away from there this spring, and may have been the same bull I saw there last year. I haven't been in there this year yet to see if itwas still there or not.

This is a close up of what I have been referring to as a small loop when using the 1x19. It was common to have several a day like this when that was what I used, and also was common when I did the BMP tests a few years back. If you look close at the cable you will see minor kinks in the cable, which is common with my system. It is caused when the cable wraps on the spike or bracket opposite side of the pole while a beaver is fighting after being caught, or wrapped around the lower set of snares. I never had over about 10 percent extremity catches with the 1x19 1/16" cable, and currently catch 15-18% of my beaver by the extremities with the 7x7. The 15% being the 3/32" and the 18% being the 5/64 7x7.
I'll try to get on here tomorrow and explain how I actually make my poles.


Edited by Rally (12/31/10 04:27 AM)
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#2336128 - 12/30/10 04:10 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Here is the photo missing from above.


Might want to edit the code. Just insert this address
http://www.trapperman.com/forum/attachments/usergals/2010/12/full-11114-7663-dscn0686.jpg

Sorry that happened Rally. Some great shots you got on so far and I know there will be some professional advice to go with them. For those of you that don't know Rally runs a trapping supply business and snares is his specialty. He is great fun to talk trapping with when you order supplies. He gives you a lot of advice when you call and ask questions. He puts up a pile of beaver so we should add to our knowledge bank when he gets around to narrating this post.
We will all be awaiting your commentary. What I would suggest is that you go back in and edit your post and put words to go with your photos. If as you do this hit the preview your changes you can keep track of what you have done. Even submit one photo or so at a time as you have time.
Thanks Rally.


Edited by Family Trapper (12/31/10 09:23 PM)
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#2336195 - 12/30/10 06:08 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Family Trapper]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
Great pictures Rally! I'll be looking forward to your comments. Thanks!

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#2336514 - 12/30/10 10:44 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
STUMPMAKER Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 44
Loc: Northwest Wisconsin
Thanks Rally, I will be starting to use your set up in a few weeks. I forgot how you cut hole in ice. I know with a chainsaw, I use same, but do you cut a " square" hole? Can not tell by your photo's on size of hole in ice. And do you cover them up with snow so they do not freeze solid??
Thanks again for the photo's and I need to order more of your snares, I should have bought more in Marshfield from you!!!

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#2336715 - 12/30/10 12:35 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
piperniner Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 1275
Loc: Alaska
Rally:

Sometime try eliminating the nails and see if you like it. One piece of snare wire - two loops. It's called the Micky Mouse snare. Small loop in top middle where you wire it to the pole, and two loops on each side like yours, but one cable.

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#2337190 - 12/30/10 04:44 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Stumpmaker,
I cut a slot about the size of a 28" chainsaw bar that is paralell to the hous and adj. to feedpile. Check back in a couple days and I'll add some better pictures.
Pipernine,
I used that system in various versions for about 12 years and caught plenty of beaver, but found it tough to use in slush, and often bent the support wires as I put it back in the water. The last year I used it it cost me about $90.00 in 31" gauntlets getting poked from wires. I had my best luck using that with a short snare that had support collars on them and then I ran a cable down the pole to allow my beaver to get away from the bottom of the ice. I bet if you tried some of the beaver spikes you wouldn't look back. I can set a pole faster than most can cut and form the wire. About 7 minutes to a pole including cutting the hole.The spike also allows the lock to set hard as the beaver makes it's first run to get away from the pole, but can be pulled off the pole to get to the bottom where it wont freeze to the bottom of the ice.
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#2337210 - 12/30/10 04:54 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Pittu Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/09/07
Posts: 895
Loc: Alaska
Nice photos and info Rally. Thanks. I dont like where you parked your snomachine in that one picture though, lol....since there wasnt a story to go with it, that ice must have held!!

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#2337554 - 12/30/10 07:16 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Pittu]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
The set where i added the two bottom snares produced this back foot catch. Actually she was up to her shoulder in one snare, but managed to get her back foot in the other top snare. For a moment I thought i had two on the pole. next set down produced the 54 Lb male



Edited by Hornhunter (12/30/10 07:18 PM)

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#2337578 - 12/30/10 07:23 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Pittu]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
I thought the same thing about the snow machine. I wish I could drive up to the huts here I just got back from setting an hour ago. Man am I beat!

Rally, What cable are you using on your snares. I use the nails like you but the cable you use stands out as a better loop them mine.

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#2338590 - 12/31/10 04:41 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Pittu,
I wasn't too crazy about the parking spot either but the alternative was running over spruce, tag alders and hummocks. The sled was only about two weeks old at the time of that picture, so was really just giving it a preview of what would be in it's future. It really looks worse than it was. There was over 20" of ice under that overflow and the tunnel needed cleaning anyway. LOL

Brandon,
I load and shape all my snares so they close fast and are that shape. Has made a world of difference for me, especially on under ice beaver.

Hornhunter,
Love them copper beaver. Just had a set of choppers made for the wife and I, out of some I caught.Do you catch alot that color in Maine?
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#2338767 - 12/31/10 08:16 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
Rally, Just read what you've posted. It's been a great lesson, and well explained out. Thanks for taking the time to write that all down.
Copper beaver, I'd say most of mine in this area have that colored guard hair. i don't travel very far and don't have alot of beaver around. "Mountains".- Northern Maine has/ or had some real nice black beaver at one time. Eastern Maine has alot of low land swampy area. Beaver are plentiful over there and to the north. Before Christmas I know Neal Olson already had around 250 trapping open water.
Picture is rather grainy. Had some choppers made also a few years back. That and my beaver hat makes for some smiles when encountered on a sled trail.

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#2340311 - 12/31/10 07:49 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.

These are the ones I just had made. The gauntlets are mine and the short mittens I had made for the wife. Sheared wool liners in all three, buffaloe on the palms and cuffs. The center pair are all buffaloe with removeable liners. I'm going to use them for stoking my outdoor wood stove. Just got them back a couple days ago and haven't snowsealed them yet.
Tough to tell in the picture but these are made of what I call "Copper Beaver". Take them out in the sunlight and they shine like a new penny. Most of my beaver are way darker than these.
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#2340543 - 12/31/10 09:29 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Wow Rally. Thanks for such an education. The photo are great. What is your experience with 1/16 7 by 7?
Wish Beaver hide prices would make a surge.
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#2340978 - 01/01/11 05:48 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Rally]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
Rally be carefull stoking that outdoor stove with those choppers. I have one ( Heat-More )and singed my beaver hat stoking her. I bet those buffalo hide palms are alot tougher than the ones i have.
Do you always make sets just using the pole as bait. I've tried it that way, but seem to have more luck with pieces of bait nailed on the sides. I have some dark water, but usually it's quite clear.
When you've made a catch how many have chewed the bait. I don't trap alot of beaver, but with 9 beaver from the snares I've only seen one stick chewed. And I think junior may? have done that after moma was attached to the pole.
I had tried using a nail Instead of wire wrapped around the pole for supporting the snare. (Probably from your post on Trapperman before,) but can't remember how i came up with the idea. And I can't remember why I didn't continue using that method.

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#2341128 - 01/01/11 09:28 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
You can see my snares here with Rally's attachment method of the nails. They do work slick.

Here is one for you to try Rally. I have used an electric meter quite a bit for checking my otter conibears under the ice. I insulate my holes and they were usually in areas that did not collect a lot of ice generally if I covered them well. I would check usually once per week. However found that every two weeks was fine. Uncovering the holes and recovering them to check and empty set took a lot of time that could be better spent. Less time checking meant more time more traps checked on a Saturday. Took all of about 30 sec to stop my machine and check. Probably 5-15 to uncover, chop and recover.
I was experimenting with using snares for otter and wanted to try and come up with a similar way to check my sets with the electric conductivity meter.
Can't say that I used it a lot but this is a method that worked pretty good. It was based on the assumption that if the lower two snares held an otter all would be knocked down. The top one was the only one that read to the meter. So if either of the bottom two were pulled down you would not know it. However you could put a wire on each if you wanted.
It used the snare wire to connect the circuit. One end of the two wire circuit was connect to the snare cable near the nail. The other end to the female bullet. A small piece of elec wire was attached to the snare. You can barely see it sticking out of the blue bullet. It fits in loosely enough that it connects but easy enough to pull out without much effort.
It was fun and I think could be a real asset to a beaver snare setup where action is not happening every check. Less time checking more snares ran. ;0)
Once you have the wires made up they would add only a little time to apply and save a lot of time.





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#2341873 - 01/01/11 04:56 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Family Trapper]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
The more I look at this set up, the more i like it. Would be a little easier getting the hardware off the pole when pulling sets as well. And those locks seem to stay in place where the cams would fall down in that position.

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#2342480 - 01/01/11 08:35 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
ccoyote Offline
trapper

Registered: 04/10/09
Posts: 1035
Loc: benton cty, Minnesota
what is the point of so many snares on one pole

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#2342513 - 01/01/11 08:44 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Coyote if you talking about my set the otter were funneled to bank by me with tree/branches. It was narrow and deep so I chose to cover all depths.
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Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2347853 - 01/03/11 11:46 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Len,
A couple things for you to try on your spikes. If you bend your bottom stop once more where it hangs on the bottom of your lock, so that it doesn't touch the lock when it is set, you will find it with take less pressure to set the snare into motion when an animal hits it. With the stop bearing on the lock like you have pictured on the Flat rate box, it causes whatever pressure the animal is exerting to the cable to be first transferred to the lock and then to the locking hole, which causes the lock to drag or bear more at the locking hole. Bend that bottom stop until it makes a near complete circle before loading the cable and it will open up just a tad when you load it. This allows the lock to "pivot" freely on the cable without the stop transferring that pressure to the locking hole. As the lock pivots on the bottom hole the elongation of the loop will reach a certain point to where the locking hole is inline with the cable and just jumps shut with much less drag of the lock on the cable. Tough to explain but take that snare you have pictured and try it after curling the "cradle" enough the stop doesn't hit the bottom of the lock and you'll see what I mean.
Also to keep your safety cable tight on the pole after you have it set, try pulling the safety cable tight and into a "gash" above ice at the top of the pole like this.
This keeps the safety cable tight until it freezes in and keeps it up where you don't chop it when you go back to check. The loose cable on the pole is a foothold for a beaver as it works the pole.
I used to use the continuity tester on conibears when I used them but don't want all the wires on my poles. I'd probably just chop them anyway. LOL I thought about adding a loop to the safety cable where I could put the wires, which they would pull when caught. May do that some day.Maybe evn put the connectors on the anchor loop on one of the spikes. That would tell a guy when they have pulled them off the pole and if put on the top snares wouldn't take alot of wire.
I tried the 1/16" 7x7 and had so many troubles with it I gave it up in short order. Really tough to get in the hole as it would curl up with hardly any slush in the hole, left bad marks on the leather, but worked well for extremity catches. I had a beaver get up on the ice and watched it break it infront of my eyes when I approached. I'd tied the safety cable to the root of an upturned tree and couldn't get a clear shot at the beaver. When I walked around the tree it made a dash for the hole which was still open and snapped the cable, or what was not already broken from it twisting it up on the baitpole, above ice. I recaught it on a regular baitpole about 4 days later and it had a terrible mark on the leather. I get a few beaver up on the ice, especially late spring, when the holes don't freeze fast, so gave up on it. Don't use Camlocs either. Mainly because when I pull them up they all freeze, and I have to blow on them to thaw enough to reset the locks to get them back in the ice. Also had some trouble with Northern Pike hitting them until I started painting them black. Lots of pike hanging around the feedpiles of beaver houses. Here the minnows are around the feedpiles and fan the ice to keep the water open, in lakes that freeze out. I have some poles I go back to and chop minnows for a foot down. I always have Crappie bait. LOL
_________________________
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#2347956 - 01/04/11 03:05 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Thanks Rally I know just what your talking about on the loading. It takes some experience to see how the loading imparts the stress points as you are describing and know what you mean by the drag affect. I will keep that in mind.
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2357482 - 01/08/11 11:12 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
I have used a chain saw in the past to cut holes in the ice, but had problems with it freezing up in between uses. Is there a solution to that problem besides a heat source.

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#2357484 - 01/08/11 11:14 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Big finn Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/21/07
Posts: 17
Loc: up of michigan
Try cutting a little wood after it will dry up the saw.

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#2358099 - 01/08/11 05:51 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Top Jimmy Offline
"Assistant Speling Zcar"

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 4555
Loc: Alaska, USA
We just gun it for a short bit and the friction of the chain dry's it out. That is the big thing, is keeping the chain from freezing to the bar. Even if it does, just run the bar across a log and when the teeth catch in the bark, it will help break it free.

-TJ
_________________________
Some people are like slinkies - not really good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.


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#2358786 - 01/08/11 10:39 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
akmarten907 Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/27/10
Posts: 50
Loc: Russian Mission, AK
You know I still haven't tried the pole/bait set before for beavers. All I've been doing is finding the runways and setting two snares there and another at the feed pile. I was thinking about the bait/pole set with a few snares on it like the ones you fellas are discussing but haven't gone around to mindling with it just yet. Does anyone use the foothold traps exclusively? Or any pics of a setup using them? Wonder if the #3 four coil bridgers would work alright?

Nick
_________________________

If at first you don't succeed, try...try again

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#2358905 - 01/09/11 12:06 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
I found two houses the other day. I have no idea how deep the water is. But after reading this thread, I'm busting out the chainsaw and going to give it a shot on tuesday.

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#2359135 - 01/09/11 06:35 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: HFT AK]
Hornhunter Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/29/06
Posts: 330
Loc: Maine
ak go to page 2 of this topic. Maineiac shows a chair set using a trap and bait

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#2359326 - 01/09/11 09:45 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
FT / Rally, I found two houses about 100 yds apart. I can see the feed pile to the first one, sticks sticking up out of the ice. The creek is maybe 15 yards wide. It is super slow moving water. When you put in your bait poles, do the snares face towards the house or does it really matter? The same goes for baited 330's.
The second house I can't tell were the feed pile is. The snow melted and you can't get down to the ice to see air bubbles, how far back from the house would you recommend placing a feed pole or baited conibear?


Edited by HFT AK (01/09/11 09:46 AM)

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#2359931 - 01/09/11 03:23 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Try to get your bait poles in high traffic areas. I always face the snares to and away from the house, so the scores will be most visable to a beaver leaving or working the edge of the feedpile, heading back to the house. If you look at the pictures of my snare poles you will see a score UNDER each snare, or where the snare hangs closest to the pole. This will bring the beaver to your loops as they most often start chewing the pole where they believe another beaver has already started chewing.
I try to keep my poles adj to the feedpile yet not so close the beaver will swim by them while leaving, without seing them or have to come back to work the pole. Most often about half way through the feedpile, or there abouts. Five foot of water is about right for a snare pole with 4 snares, much deeper and I may consider putting 6 snares on the pole. Soft or hard bottom at this location?
Here is a picture of a buddy of mine and my finger in the picture. Note the location of the poles and the feed pile. If you look at the far side of the feed pile you will see there are two poles sticking up there(downstream), and only one by him. I have my best luck most often downstream from the house and often put two poles here. Why, I believe is that the beaver are coming out of the house and carrying waste sticks or sticks they have already peeled, and because they (particularly the adult male) uses this exit most often, as it is closest to the dam, which I believe he checks any time he leaves the lodge.
If you get a chance to check out a beaver colony during open water periods, you'll most likely see most droppings and peeled sticks just downstream from the lodge. Wether it is the current that causes them to collect there or the beaver deposits them there I cannot prove, but have had my best luck downstream from the lodge when snaring in a colony that resides where there is much current.


Edited by Rally (01/09/11 03:34 PM)
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#2360844 - 01/09/11 08:16 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
I poked around today and found a third house. There are this years cuts on the trees nearby, but I'll be danged if I can locate a feed bed. Tuesday I'm going to take the chainsaw and put in some sets, I'll take pic's and see what happens.

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#2360963 - 01/09/11 08:54 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Are the breather holes on the tops of the houses "crystalized"?
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Keep your boots dry

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#2360995 - 01/09/11 09:07 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
I want to say yes, but there is so much dang frost right now. The houses look small, but there is fresh cut (this years) around each house.

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#2361217 - 01/09/11 10:07 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
otterman Offline



Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 2397
Loc: SW Alaska
HFT there possibly are beaver there and the feed is all under ice & overflow check for the crsytalization Rally talks of as a sign someone is home
_________________________

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#2361228 - 01/09/11 10:11 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
I'll do that. I seen otter sign in the begining of the year near one house, but other then thier tracks I have not seen anything else of them.

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#2361560 - 01/10/11 07:18 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: HFT AK]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
I've run into the same thing on some dead water going into a lake. No dam, house is definitely occupied. Cut a half dozen holes up and down stream from house and found no feed bed. Don't they usually put their feed bed close to the house? The beaver cut off the sticks I put in the holes so I'm going to set it soon as my snares come in. Wish I had found this post before I ordered my snaring supplies.

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#2363756 - 01/10/11 11:10 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
I'd put down a couple poles at each house. The worst that can happen is they will chew the pole and not get caught. At least then you'll know to reset.
_________________________
Keep your boots dry

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#2363855 - 01/11/11 12:02 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
alaska viking Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/25/07
Posts: 1825
Loc: juneau, alaska
I have a similar deal, however, my beaver in this area are an attractant for more desieable critters, and as such, I leave them alone. Beaver are generally easy to catch. Wait for ice-out, if you must, and the hides will be prime.
_________________________
Intellectual capacity is no guarantee against being dead wrong.
Carl Sagan.

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#2364187 - 01/11/11 07:56 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
That brings up a good point. This is my first year trapping and don't plan on racking up big numbers, just get feel for it, work out the kinks so I can do it on a bigger scale next year. There doesn't seem to be anyone else trapping beaver in the area that I'm going to be. What month would you say the hides are in the best shape over all.

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#2366046 - 01/11/11 09:11 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
So today I went back to the beaver houses and looked for the vent holes to see if they are active. It looks like two are and the third not. I took some pic's of what I think are the vent holes but I would like some feedback.
Pic of the first house


Vent holes? The frost around them was bigger then the surrounding trees.



So is this what Ishould be looking for? I didn't set it yet. Got an order in yesterday and was busy cranking out snares.

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#2366085 - 01/11/11 09:27 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Cheqaumegon Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/09/10
Posts: 5
Loc: South Central Wisconsin
The first vent hole looks good, probably two adults and some juvies in there. The second and third, I am assuming are from a different house. Maybe have a bachelor staying in there. Go get em! grin

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#2366169 - 01/11/11 10:05 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
3 Fingers Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/22/08
Posts: 525
Loc: alaska
My experience is that an inactive house can still have somewhat of a vent hole from the warmer air. Plus if the 2 houses are only 100 yards apart it may be one family using both houses with only one cache. I'd set them both as the worst that can happen is empty traps/snares. Sometimes it's the big male that uses the "old" house.

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#2366183 - 01/11/11 10:15 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: crowley]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
You have to be ....... to trap beaver under the ice.









Thought you guys would enjoy seeing this.

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#2366223 - 01/11/11 10:38 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Top Jimmy Offline
"Assistant Speling Zcar"

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 4555
Loc: Alaska, USA
Ouch! I have had that a few times and it sucks.

-TJ
_________________________
Some people are like slinkies - not really good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.


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#2366255 - 01/11/11 11:04 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
otterman Offline



Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 2397
Loc: SW Alaska
That's why when I go after beaver through the ice maximum check times are two days
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#2366434 - 01/12/11 04:19 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
akmarten907 Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/27/10
Posts: 50
Loc: Russian Mission, AK
Holy buckets man, that's serious ice on that guy laugh I look for the vent holes too and also I check for their runways and if I get that fast gush of stink air come up from under the ice than I know beavers are using the huts. Just something I learned not very long ago.


Nick
_________________________

If at first you don't succeed, try...try again

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#2367965 - 01/12/11 05:51 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: akmarten907]
Swamp Walker Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/08/07
Posts: 196
Loc: Palmer, Alaska
Yeah I did that once too Brandon, problem is I wasn't as smart as you, I used a chain saw.

You can probably predict where this story is going, but to sum it up: Filleted beaver!

That was several years ago. In todays market it wouldn't have hurt the value much. I used it as a home tanning experiment.
_________________________
"This gun ain't powerful, but it'll shoot the nuts off a bonsai tree..." Hal Sullivan

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#2368048 - 01/12/11 06:21 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
AKscott Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/07/07
Posts: 137
Loc: north pole, AK
going out tonight to set a house my self i tried last night but the 18in bar didnt cut it headed back with the auger saw and rock bar, also im going to set entrances i have never had any luck with bait sets, im gona try and use my scuba light to locate runs then get a 330 right in the door way, man i wish i would have marked them in the summer, so will see how that works.
_________________________
"Speak softly and carry a big stick"
tr

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#2368404 - 01/12/11 08:10 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
otterman Offline



Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 2397
Loc: SW Alaska
Picked up a nice beaver in a swinging coni today
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#2368410 - 01/12/11 08:12 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
How far under the ice did you have ot otterman?

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#2368519 - 01/12/11 08:53 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
HFT AK,
Thats what they look like. I'm not sure of the locations from the pictures, but that's what they should look like on the top of a snow covered house if they are active. Doesn't always mean that there are beaver in them, and could be either otter or a bunch of muskrats, but most likely beaver.
The first picture you have of the beaver house looks like there are two runs coming out of the house, and I'd go look for a bank run or feed station by that tree that has fallen in the water. They like using upturned root systems as feed stations and that one appears to have a slight hump near the base.
Here an active house would have much more mud on it, but sometimes an old bachelor doesn't mud much and that may be what you have there.I've not trapped beaver in Ak (my wife won't let me go) so am not real familiar with their building patterns.


Edited by Rally (01/12/11 08:57 PM)
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Keep your boots dry

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#2368615 - 01/12/11 09:29 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Rally]
yukonjeff Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/02/08
Posts: 823
Loc: M.T.V. Alaska
one way to be sure a house is active is to check the grub pile and if its green its active..if dead sticks..then not..they all have breath holes that frost up regaurdless..

and like Otterman..I never go longer than a two day check in cold weather.

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#2368619 - 01/12/11 09:32 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
otterman Offline



Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 2397
Loc: SW Alaska
HFT it was in a narrow little creek the water is barley 3 feet deep I bent the bottom spring up towards the trap and left the other one straight out and the chain was just under the ice with the bottom spring hitting the bottom. I use the set a lot and generally like to have the trap like described above even in deep water situations with the bait on the free jaw
_________________________

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#2369550 - 01/13/11 11:34 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
WI Coonarse Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/10/10
Posts: 16
Loc: WI, between EauClaire and Supe...
even green feedbed dosent guarentee beaver are there. Our wolves are gettng better at targeting beaver i think, found two houses last year with green feedbed but no beaver. My theory is the wolves got them right before freeze up, or they were trapped in the fall. Didnt look like they were trapped at the houses, deep in private property.
_________________________
Some day they'll name a trap after me.

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#2369568 - 01/13/11 11:47 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: WI Coonarse]
yukonjeff Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/02/08
Posts: 823
Loc: M.T.V. Alaska
Having a green grubpile,and ice bubbles around it, is the only way to see that there at least WAS active beaver in the falltime at least..around here that means beaver still in it unlesss a trapper cleans them out,like probably your case.
wolves do eat beaver,but cleaning them all out like that is unlikly IMO

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#2369662 - 01/13/11 12:39 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
WI Coonarse Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/10/10
Posts: 16
Loc: WI, between EauClaire and Supe...
I hear ya jeff, if they were trapped it would have to have been a long way from the house though.
Just dosent seem right. I'm talking about a couple small houses, most likely a pair in each, in about 3/4 mile section of river. Couldnt see bubbles or no bubbles, no clear ice.
_________________________
Some day they'll name a trap after me.

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#2370637 - 01/13/11 07:40 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Top Jimmy Offline
"Assistant Speling Zcar"

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 4555
Loc: Alaska, USA
Or shot. Have noticed since they opened the flats to shooting beaver in the fall, that we tend to find huts with a green feed bed and no beavers. At least once the air boaters can get to.

-TJ
_________________________
Some people are like slinkies - not really good for anything, but they bring a smile to your face when pushed down the stairs.


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#2370817 - 01/13/11 08:37 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
I tried setting today.My little 18 inch chainsaw couldn't even get me close to water. After cutting 3 and 1/2 feet I started busting a sweat and called it quits! What the heck do you do when the ice is that darn thick?

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#2370859 - 01/13/11 08:51 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
AKscott Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/07/07
Posts: 137
Loc: north pole, AK
i feel for ya hfk i went out today expecting to get a couple houses set up got out there started with the auger trying to find deep water around the hut to set runs well that didnt happen so i got out the chain saw pulled it about 100 times with no start so i ended up drilling 3 holes next to each other by the cach and beating the ice between them out and hanging 1 330 with pvc on the trigger and a nice pice of birch on the lower jaw im not expecting much with 1 trap but i only relly need 1 beav for bait so will see ill check it on sat. also using the scuba light to check things out under the ice works pretty good.
_________________________
"Speak softly and carry a big stick"
tr

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#2370933 - 01/13/11 09:17 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: HFT AK]
Ol' Blister Offline


Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 875
Loc: McGrath, Alaska
Originally Posted By: HFT AK
I tried setting today.My little 18 inch chainsaw couldn't even get me close to water. After cutting 3 and 1/2 feet I started busting a sweat and called it quits! What the heck do you do when the ice is that darn thick?


Ken would cut me the four edges and one down the middle and one across. Then I would go to work with the ice pick. I'd go till I hit water. One of my favorite pictures, that I have posted before, is of that clear, clear ice that forms under the overflow and snow. When I see that I know the water isn't too far below.



I wish I had pictures of this one hole I kept chopping away at, saying, "Surely I am going to hit water with this chop!" I dug down about 4 feet !!!! Thank goodness there really WAS that fateful chop that brought water ;o) .....and it was a gusher!

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#2371139 - 01/13/11 10:45 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Ol' Blister]
Ak trout Offline
trapper

Registered: 10/30/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Alaska
Heres my very first beaver. Did a bit of read through the archives to get ideas and to see some sets. Then had a buddy that knew of some beavers that no one was going after so, what the heck. Why not.

I started out trying a baited set and I'm pretty sure the beavers were just laughing as they swam by. Then this heat wave we have a bit ago re=opened everything and I found this sweet little chute leading straight from the hut to the stream.




So I threw a 330 in there, its just deep enough for a 330 with maybe a couple inches above the top.
Came back two days later and ....





This thing was heavy or I'm just out of shape from sitting in front of my computer working on my masters
Reset and checked again today and picked up another one. Re-set and repeat

Thanks for all the tips and advice that you guys are willing to share.
Trout-


Edited by Ak trout (01/13/11 11:08 PM)
Edit Reason: spelling
_________________________
Dont forget your trapping License

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#2371171 - 01/13/11 11:01 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
HFT AK Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 397
Loc: Wasilla AK
Way to go!
OB- I feel like a sis now! Thanks!

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#2371270 - 01/14/11 01:18 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
A few pointer from my beaver trapping in the cold and ice.
Chainsaw. I found nothing worked better than keeping my saw thawed out on the day I was setting a lot. I filled jugs up with hot water and it was nice. Cut and put it away.


One trick I figured out for going deeper than the blade was to saw a bunch of chris cross cubes. They fell apart real easy. Got them out and went deeper.



When ever I set runs coming out of the house. And this is my favorite Dec set. I use my hole finder. A piece of conduit bent with a 90 and a wooden handle. It is my underwater eyes. And if you use one, and you are like me, you won't ever want to be without it again. Multiples ways to use it under the ice. It is my underwater eyes.



I often don't get back right away and with conibears my beaver can be under the water for quite a while. While I prefer a two to three day check I can wait a week if I need to. I insulate all my holes. Stick, cardboard, pile of snow.
20below for a week. You might have a couple of inches. Most of the time it is a half inch. I don't like chopping ice.


And when it is cold out be happy your not skinning beaver on your sled. Cause you don't have a house to do it at. ;0)



_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2371484 - 01/14/11 08:03 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
STUMPMAKER Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 44
Loc: Northwest Wisconsin
HFK AK-et a longer chain bar. I start with a 20" bar and go up to a 36" bar and then if still not long enough I take up reading till spring time. Good luck and stay warm

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#2371600 - 01/14/11 09:31 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
WI Coonarse Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/10/10
Posts: 16
Loc: WI, between EauClaire and Supe...
we must be soft down here in WI stumpmaker- I was gonna say the same thing- When the ice gets that thick I figure them beaver can wait til spring. We got it a little easier than them guys up in God's country as far as that goes though.
_________________________
Some day they'll name a trap after me.

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#2371704 - 01/14/11 10:43 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Spek Jones Offline
"FATHER"

Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 812
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Theres a line somewhere there between too soft and too bullheaded. smile
Anymore if I can't stick a 28" bar through the ice and hit water I move to
another spot or another pond. The days when I would chop through 4 ft of
ice for a 12 dollar beaver are pretty well past. Seemed like too many times I would chop a 4 foot hole and hit gravel or not enough water to make a set.
Went up river about ten miles one time and cut a hole through 3 ft of ice
to make a set for bank beaver. We cut a hole about 30" square and hit a gusher like OB mentioned. Water was boiling up about a foot above the surface and that hole flooded the whole river all the way to the mouth with two feet of water. It shut down that whole section of trapline for a
week before it finally froze over again enough to travel on. (Something to watch out for).

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#2371841 - 01/14/11 12:17 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
piperniner Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 1275
Loc: Alaska
Each to his own - I'll take a 10 inch Jiffy . I asked them about a 12 inch one time, but they said the spiral stock doesn't pencil out for limited sales. Anyone try out the new propane model yet ?

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#2371856 - 01/14/11 12:26 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
otterman Offline



Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 2397
Loc: SW Alaska
I like the ice auger as well use to do the chisel thing and remember being on my knees on the ice hanging on to the end of a 5 foot chisel more than once before punching through, and people wonder why I don't like chiseling ice much anymore.
_________________________

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#2371871 - 01/14/11 12:42 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: otterman]
yukonjeff Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/02/08
Posts: 823
Loc: M.T.V. Alaska
I also use the the 10'' jiffy..and was the best investment I ever made..two or 3 side by side holes and chip out the pointed sections and you can hang 3 snares and off to the next house..you can set 10 houses or more a day...the checking then is the hard part..dont want to set to many.

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#2371872 - 01/14/11 12:43 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
I have always been hesitant to use my ice auger after my first time using it. I thought man this is going to be cool. First time on a beaver hole. I reved it up and let fly. About half way down it grabbed a hold of a nice chunk of frozen wood and wam! About turned me around in a circle and bent my shaft. The auger always had a very slight wobble after that. shocked
That is why I like Dec beaver trapping runs. If I can punch through with my icepick in one good thrust when looking for the run I move on. Too many beaver out here to not just move to the next house.
Once they get bait hungry I will move from entrances. But I pretty much do beaver just for bait now.
I wish the price would spike on them some day. A guy could make some money at $100 a beaver.
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2371906 - 01/14/11 01:10 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
piperniner Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 1275
Loc: Alaska
Like YJ says, side by side holes allows for 330's as well. One hole works for me on snares. Similar to Rally, I make one snare with two loops( no nails ) and you can stack them depending on water depth. Just lightly squeeze both loops together and slide down on the pole through the hole.
I'm like you FT, mostly for Wolverine bait. But if a guy has the energy, you could do ok between hide, musher carcass, castor and skull sales.
I'm thinking the new propane one might be interesting. Just keep the bottle under the cowl for a short period if real cold.

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#2372747 - 01/14/11 07:37 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Predator Wild Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 30
Loc: NW Missouri
That was a GREAT read, thanks for all the info and especially the pictures. Any idea what trees the beaver eat in MO?
_________________________
~ Heath

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#2372775 - 01/14/11 07:47 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Predator Wild]
otterman Offline



Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 2397
Loc: SW Alaska
Originally Posted By: Predator Wild
Any idea what trees the beaver eat in MO?

Green ones laugh laugh
_________________________

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#2372877 - 01/14/11 08:38 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: otterman]
Clark Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/22/06
Posts: 935
Loc: Duluth, MN
Rally - I always enjoy your information about trapping beaver under the ice. Several years ago you wrote an article that appeared in one of NAFA's publications and you detailed how you set runs with snares. Thanks to that information I caught this beauty by the snout:



Interestingly we caught two beaver at this lodge on the same check and both were caught exactly as you see this one. I never had it happen before and never since like that.

Concerning loaded snares I've always gone the other way with unloaded snares. My theory was that a beaver is not real delicate when it is under water and the chances of it being outside your snare loop when it bumps it are just as good as it being inside the snare loop. With the unloaded snare (and a real raspy lock, too) the beaver would have to really pull on the loop before the snare was fired. Merely swimming by or bumping it with a tail wouldn't fire it. Any thoughts on this system? Typically I was using 5/64" 7x7 cable and catching beaver by extremities so I was satisfied with it.

Clark
_________________________
Common sense is the collection of prejudices acquired by age eighteen. -Albert Einstein

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#2372925 - 01/14/11 09:06 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
I have a question.
Our beaver population is over the top. Not a bit of water that could hold one that doesn't have a house on it. Were talking lots.
When I trapped beaver in Montana the typical was one large breeding pair per house and of course the subadults and kits.
Never do I remember getting multiple large beaver in a house.
However the other day we pulled out a nice female. I would say in the blanket class. 68 inch or so. Female as I was showing a teacher the parts and pieces. She had had no kits however the previous summer. Three days later out of the same house we got another, slightly larger female that had had kits as you could see lactating nipples from this summer. Rally or others have you seen this very often. I have not paid a lot of attention but know of at least thee times I have seen this out here.
Curious if our beaver are the ones practicing polygamy.
grin

On another note. Got a pm from someone wanting to know any tips on finding entrances.
Thought I would share some ideas with all.
I have set a lot and they are my preferred in Nov and Dec as that is when bait is easiest to get and the least work to get it.
I like to go out in Nov early Dec. After that it is a lot harder. But still you can look for some things.
The entrances, always a min of two but not uncommon to have 3 or 4. I like to get three set on a big house. Early in the season I look for bubble paths. They guide you right in.
But usually after snow this is harder. But the fact that their are bubbles in the ice works to your benifit. I walk around the house with my ice pick and thud hard ever foot or so. Listen, alot of the time you will get a different feel and sound. Hollow sounding and softer. It is not much different but it it often a clue. It is made from the air bubbles in the ice from their air bubbles when swimming. In Nov and early Dec on a warm year like this 80% of the houses your ice pick will go right through it is so thin over these entrances. Be careful. If you find this you find the entrance.
Later but not too late I take my chainsaw an bury the blade every two feet or so straight up and down looking for water. It is like getting an instant hole to the water. As you work your way around the house the thinner ice will show up in the depth you have to go with the chainsaw. This is a great technique. A good saw goes in like a hot knife on butter.
You can generally count on an entrance coming out on both sides of the house if the feeder is right in front. I look for subtle differences in the house to see where an entrance might be but it still varies a lot.
Indentations seem to hold a entrance a lot of times.

Earlier discussion talked about breathing vents.
This was the mother of all vents I have seen.
We took two otter and a pile of beaver out of this house. Had the entrances just right and it was 2-3 animals for a number of checks. I love that when that happens. That one house kept me in beaver all winter for bait.











Edited by Family Trapper (01/14/11 09:11 PM)
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2373255 - 01/14/11 11:18 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
otterman Offline



Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 2397
Loc: SW Alaska
Len, In the past I trapped in what most would consider a large group as many as 10 guys in a beaver camp but with limits of 10 or 20 it wasn't a big deal as there were plenty of beaver and it was a fun time for all. Anyway we would pull snares off a house if we got a kit after the 2nd check if not we kept snaring till we got a kit often getting as many as 6 or 8 large/med beaver out of the house and once we took an all time high of 11 before with one being a kit. We trapped one house and took something like 6 out of it and my wife's uncle recalled how yrs before he and several others including my father in law had taken 21 out of that same house with none being kits. We would trap a place one yr rest it 2 then hit it again but often someone else would hit it when we were not trapping it. It seems incredible but it is the truth. With the explosion of the beaver population here I no longer see this on the river beaver. If I take 4 out of a house one is a kit and try not to take more than 2 or 3 out of any house. The beaver in the flats I never saw in big numbers we seldom took more than 4 from a house and now days I seldom take more than 2.
_________________________

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#2373472 - 01/15/11 02:40 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
trapperbobs Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/20/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Alaska, USA
I have been lurking a lot this year, and finally got a little gear out. Out of several hundred beaver I have caught, only one has been under ice with bait. I just have always favored dam breaks, castor mounds, bank dens and channel sets. But last week I added two more to my baited catch using Rally's bait pole with snares. So to get to the point I went to a pond I took two beaver out of last winter, a large female in a bank den, and a kit in a bank den. I also had several fired conibears at the dam. So upon return this year I was amazed at the sign around this pond, the entire bottom is covered in chewed sticks. A government agency has been breaking the dam as indicated by what looked like two new houses where the dam is. I decided I would hit them hard on this pond. I proceeded to set 2 dam breaks with 330's, foot hold drowner where they had been in open water chewing on a old dry log, a baited 330 on a pole, a bank den with a 280 and a 3" snare pole with 4 snares a foot below 1 1/2" of clear ice where a lot of feeding was occuring. The open water was left over from our latest melt down. Return next day to nothing in traps WOW I wasn't ready for that. One 330 at dam break holds a 3'x1" stick carefully placed by smart old beaver. The snare pole is gone about 16" below the ice all snares knocked down but not pulled tight. The night before I read this topic from cover to cover. So I moved the foothold over to the dam break and cut a much bigger 5" pole from a cottonwood they had downed I set it with two snares a foot below the ice and two more below that in about 7' of water. I return two days later to ever thickening ice. Walah A kit is frozen to the bottom of the ice which is still clear but about 5" thick. I chop a big square free to remove him as pole is still intact, and then try and figure out which snares are on him without pulling the whole pole out. In the process I dropped a snare down the hole, not a big deal. Finally take both top snares off the kit and load him and 10+ pounds of ice in bag and sled. Because of thickening ice I decide to pull all gear until schedule works better. A voice in my head says that snare sunk down the hole just a little fast so I sweep the ice out of the hole and peer down to a big tail snared male laying 7' down on the bottom. It took a little fishing but I got him out of there and was pretty jazzed about the results. I am one of those guys that loves to trap beaver. I pulled an ice glazed marten also so not to bad a day. Thanks for the pictures and info, I really like the nail/snare and plan to use it soon. I have caught up to ten beaver out of a house, and a 58 and a 63 LB male out of the same house. I found a couple other good prospects I will try and get before and after pictures next time.




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#2373478 - 01/15/11 03:00 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Cool. Looks like your making this thread work in your favor. Do you ever rub your soaked beaver in snow to dry off? Does't look like you have much to work with.
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2373489 - 01/15/11 03:28 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
trapperbobs Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/20/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Alaska, USA
The whole country is hard as a brick from that last warm, but yes I have dried them in the snow it does work well. Iwas right around 10 deg and I couldn't even let them touch the ice or they would have stuck. I want to get it so they don't get up to the ice and freeze in that will give me a little more challenge to ponder for future sets.

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#2373544 - 01/15/11 06:47 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: trapperbobs]
yukonjeff Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/02/08
Posts: 823
Loc: M.T.V. Alaska
Keep in mind if you are breaching there dam..you can freeze the whole family out,and they can die,when the water freezes below there hole in the house..not a good practice IMO

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#2373578 - 01/15/11 07:34 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
trapperbobs Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/20/08
Posts: 87
Loc: Alaska, USA
I only drop the water a few inches and as long as there are beaver in the house it will be repaired. Most places I trap have a steady run of water through the dam all winter I have never drained one of any significant level.

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#2375613 - 01/15/11 11:25 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Family Trapper]
lorne Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 119
Loc: Manitoba Canada
Originally Posted By: Family Trapper
I have a question.

Never do I remember getting multiple large beaver in a house.
However the other day we pulled out a nice female. I would say in the blanket class. 68 inch or so. Female as I was showing a teacher the parts and pieces. She had had no kits however the previous summer. Three days later out of the same house we got another, slightly larger female that had had kits as you could see lactating nipples from this summer. Rally or others have you seen this very often.


I see that on a regular basis.. Here if theres is water you got beaver.We have a very high population of beaver it is not uncommon to see in ponds 3 houses and numerous bank dens in use. Usually only one with a feedpile at it.On most smaller creeks there is 4-6 houses with feedbeds per mile.
3 yrs ago on an adc job in the fall I took 50 beaver out of a stretch of creek maybe a 1/3 of a mile in length.
Btw I really enjoyed this thread In particular Rallys snaring bit.


Edited by lorne (01/15/11 11:28 PM)
_________________________
Respect the animal ,it was a gift,as was the right to harvest it.


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#2375933 - 01/16/11 06:49 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Predator Wild Offline
trapper

Registered: 09/14/10
Posts: 30
Loc: NW Missouri
Your post and many of the replies motivated me to get out yesterday and search for some beaver. With a little help from my brother and the land owner I found this spot where the beaver have been exiting the water to chew on the trees.





There is a 330 set under the water in the above photo and another that is set with a piece of PVC zip tied to the trap as bait. I'm excited at the prospect of pulling my first beaver out of the water and will be headed out to do trap checks after I get off this computer. Thanks again!
_________________________
~ Heath

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#2376580 - 01/16/11 01:03 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Cazador Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/22/09
Posts: 326
Loc: Eagle River, Alaska
Looks like you could get a double if you snared their trail and put the snare on a drowner wire.

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#2377361 - 01/16/11 06:31 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Len,
Beaver clonies can be anything, especially if they are trapped regularly. I've taken 28 out of a colony and the friend in the above picture took 4 out of the same colony, for a total of 32.He was setting bank dens with conibears and I was using snare poles. They quit going to bank dens after 4 days. The lodge was huge, about 30' across the base with two "wings" on two sides. There were three sets of adult beaver in that lodge and one huge queen bee. This lake was close to a road and was trapped by road trappers in the spring every spring. Heres my theory.
Quite often here, the big beaver push is in the spring. When prices are decent guys really set about anything deep enough to submerge a 330 to the spring eyes or deep enough to drown with a foothold. The vast majority are scent mound sets with a castor based lure and bait pieces or mud or both. Here, in the spring, the adult males travel alot within their home ranges. By staying away from the lodges, the vast majority of the beaver caught will be 2-5 year old males. I normally run 75-80% male over female. The later into the spring season, or while doing ADC contracts in may- june, that % will start swinging higher to female, as dispersal is in full swing and I thin the males down. I can only catch what is there, and if the males are thinned down that leaves a higher percentage of females. Since the males do the majority of traveling and protecting of the colony, they are more susceptable to being caught during the spring season, by road trappers who are setting at the bridges, as a convenience, rather than them going to the colonies, and exposing their sets to the entire colony. It is common to go into a winter colony the following year, in colonies close to the roads, or on major travelways like rivers, and find the adult pair to be of a different age class, usually the male being at least a year younger than the female. I have found in this case, and if there is ample food supply, the female will not chase off, the then almost 2 year old offspring. She has already been bred in lodge the previous spring, will pair with a traveling male, and her then 2 year old offspring will often stay and build lodges close, sometines as "Wings" on the existing lodge. Consider also that since the adult male is gone, that the 2 year old females can then pair and stay in the colony. I've not noticed as many males in these colonies as females, so am assuming they are either getting caught at a higher rate, or are moving out to establish their own colony. And also consider that beaver are rodents, and that it would be likely in this scenerio, for the adult beaver moving into this colony to breed several females. Infact I've trapped colonies that indicated that, by catching up to 11 yearlings in what I believed to be this scenerio. I see no reason why a traveling male that establishes with a colony that has no adult male wouldn't breed all receptive females.
I've also trapped huge houses with small feedbeds and only caught a single scarred male too, so all bets are off as far as colony dynamics are concerned in my mind, in colonies close to roads that are easily accessed.
However, alot of what I trap are miles and miles of bog. The beaver dig out ponds, usually near an island of popple, and build houses on under water tree root wads, tussocks, small sand points etc, that would hold a house. They are surrounded by miles and miles of floating bog, with little worry from predators by way of land.A few pups mat be taken by eagles or otter but for the most part they have pretty safe life. Access to them for a trapper is by many hours of drag, push, or pulling of a canoe, or by snomachine.Most will die of old age. These colonies are usually an adult pair the first year, six beaver the second year being the adult pair and 4 pups, then the third year will be 10-12 being the adult pair, 4 1.5 year olds, and 4-6 pups, depending on the fertility and food supply. I have found it rare to be much more than this as the food supply really determines what the pond will hold and the adults will let stay. These beaver often are living off popple islands and have somewhat limited supplies. It behooves them to push the first years pups out to maintain a healthy colony.It is common to see these colonies expand in the same general area, by that I mean a few nautical miles, as is evident by their colors. I have several colonies that are pure black, I've farmed for over twenty years. If i trap about 40% of the colony and leave it alone for 2 or 3 years, it bears these black beaver consistantly. I have some colonies I won't trap at all, but just trap the surrounding ponds.I learned in my younger years that killing these colonies is not in my best interest.


Edited by Rally (01/16/11 06:33 PM)
_________________________
Keep your boots dry

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#2377640 - 01/16/11 08:03 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Thanks Rally that was an excellent read.
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2378008 - 01/16/11 09:44 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Steven 49er Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/18/10
Posts: 84
Loc: mn north of blakely
Never do I remember getting multiple large beaver in a house.

FT first question I have for you is what's definition of large?

Mine is 60 inch plus.

When the beaver population in a water shed gets high any kind of population dynamic goes out the window.

I had a house about 4 5 years ago on a pretty good size lake that had probably 4 different lodges with feedpiles on it.

One of the houses I took 6 blankets with a total of twelve beaver in three traps.

I've taken 3 4 blankets several time other times.

Set a house 2 years ago I would have bet you my best chisel was gonna be a pair.

Set 2 traps, first check 1 60, second check 2 60 inchers, third check one more 60, than I pulled. I was leaving that area.

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#2378644 - 01/17/11 08:46 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Steven 49er]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
Is there a big difference in the quality of beaver fur between now and the end of march? A couple of you guys have brought this up. I am wondering just how much of a price difference there is and if it's worth waiting for.

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#2384459 - 01/19/11 10:07 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: crowley]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
I am not an expert but I believe the fur is best right now under the ice and starts to degrade when in the spring. That said though its not a big difference and probably will not show in the price.


Rally,
I appreciate the fact that you are willing to share your past experiences I am just starting with the experimenting of different materials and locks and planned to spend the next 20 years or so learning it the hard way!

This year I started out using the 1/16 7x7 with micro or washer locks. I had lots of knock downs but eventually they connect. After reading about your success with the 5/64 7x7 coupled with the fact that otter season runs parallel to our beaver season I decided to change over and try it for this year. This was the first snare pole I had set with it and I spent a good portion of yesterday changing out my poles with the new snares on the rest of the ponds. Still got a few more to do.


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#2384481 - 01/19/11 10:16 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
Can someone elaborate on how the cables are used to secure the snares to above the ice? I set one up the other day but when thinking about it I realized I could loose a beaver with the way I had done it.

In the past when I have seen this done the cable is run through the loops of the bottom snares and through itself lopping it tight around the pole. Then its run up the pole through the loops of the top snares and continues up to above the ice. Is that correct? If so could you not end up having a catch on the top snares that slides part way down the cable and then have another beaver come along and cut and take the pole leaving just the cable and in doing so make it possible that the snare with the catch on it could slip down the cable and off the end of it over both the other snares?

I hope that makes sense.
Its possible I just done understand the correct way to do the cables. For now I have continued to just use wire. I suppose I could run longer cables and bring both ends up to the surface but that seems like a pain.

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#2384711 - 01/19/11 12:04 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
STUMPMAKER Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/18/08
Posts: 44
Loc: Northwest Wisconsin
Brandon-
are you using Rally's set up? if so you take the safety cable he provides, one end is adjustable the other not, you run the loop of the safety cable that is not adjustable throught the bottom snare end and back on the safety line making it secure to it, then run the adjustable end up to you rother snares then to a safety pole up on the ice like, a dead- dry stong stick.

Hope this is some what clear to uinderstand. Not rocket building here but you can think this one out.
Good Luck!!

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#2384968 - 01/19/11 02:06 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: STUMPMAKER]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
Nope I made up some of my own snares from the 5/64th. I have not seen Rally's safety cables so I did not totally follow what you were saying but like you said its not rocket science and can be thought through. Seems to me you need a continuous loop of cable running through all the loops on the snares coming back to itself so they can't come off. So the safety cable goes down the pole through the snares back up the pole through the top snares then hooks to itself. Do I have it right?

p.s. I like the nails I have used them in the past but this time around I am putting a second double ferrule on the loop of the snare and crimping it to the cable on the top of the loop. Then I can wrap a piece of wire on the pole and slip the snare over it using the none crimped side of the Ferrule. Makes the adjustment of the snare very easy.

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#2385003 - 01/19/11 02:22 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Brandon Yuchasz]
holdengr Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/07/07
Posts: 832
Loc: Ontario
Originally Posted By: Brandon Yuchasz

Its possible I just done understand the correct way to do the cables. For now I have continued to just use wire. I suppose I could run longer cables and bring both ends up to the surface but that seems like a pain.




For a safety wire I take a length of 12.5ga wire and secure one end to a 5" piece of flat bar that has a hole in the center. Now take the tag end of the wire and thread it though all your snare end loops. Then wrap the tag end around the pole that will stay on top of the ice. Now the snares cant slide off either end of the safety wire even if they break the pole..

Next simply attach snares to the pole however you want, nails, fence staples, zipties.......



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#2386113 - 01/19/11 08:23 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Brandon,
My spikes have a small loop on the spikes or brackets have an eye built into them. Either system will work with my safety cables. It looks like you have real large loops in the anchor end of your snares where the second double ferrule is at. With loops that bi it would not work with my type setup, as the hole rig would slip through those big loops and all the snares and beaver would be lost.
I;m just going by the picture you have posted, but am curious as to why you have such big loops on the anchor end of your snares? Are they crimped on one side and opened to go around the bait pole?
If you look at the pictures of my bait poles you can see the small loops on the beaver spikes at the anchor end. I usually put four snares to a pole, with two up just under the ice and two at the bottom, with the center of the bottom loop being 18"-20" to the CENTER of the bottom loop from the bottom. My safety cables have one adjustable loop end and one fixed loop end. After my snares are on the pole where I want them, I run the fixed loop end of my safety cable through the loops on the bottom two snares, then run the adjustable loop end or the safety cable through the fixed loop of the safety cable and pull it tight. I then spin the bait pole while moving the safety cable up the pole(barber pole the safety cable)and then run the adjustable end of the safety cable through the loops on the top two snares while turning the pole in the same direction. Then I make a deep gash in the bait pole above where the top of the ice will be(there is a picture on this post somewhere)and pull the safety cable into this gash, which holds my safety cable tight on the pole, to make it easier to work with and to keep any cable loops from forming in the safety cable below the ice or in the hole where I'll be chopping later. I then lay a dead pole on the ice and open the adjustable end of the safety cable and pull it tight on the pole laying on the ice. Then I roll up all slack cable and use the dead pole to keep my bait pole positioned in the center of my hole until it freezes in place.
When a beaver gets caught and chews my pole up or in half,or sveral pieces, the bottom two snares and the safety cable are pulled into a tight cluster at the end of the safety cable, and the upper snares are all threaded through the small loops on the end of the spikes, which cant be pulled past the bottom two snares, which are clusted with the safety cable below them. Even when the beaver eat the whole pole, which I hope they do, the snares wwill just be hanging below the ice. I'd prefer the old bait pole is gone completely for two reasons. First it tells me there are still beaver in the colony, and second because it is easier for me to just pull up cable and a beaver and remake with a fresh pole, rather than strip the snares off a half chewed and then remake a new pole.
With the large loops on the ends of your snares they would just slide over the bottom snares if you used my type of safety cable setup.
If your snares are capable of tightening down to a small loop, you could also use them as is, by just running a safety cable through the adjustable loops and pulling them tight on the safety cable on the upper two, and through the loops of the bottom two and through the safety cable bottom loop like I do mine.
To eliminate the second ferrule you are using for a support, try just forming W's in the end of your support wires with your lineman pliers. Then just wrap the cable of the snares around it and into the bends of the W's just behind the locks. It would save your self some money on the extra ferrules and you wouldn't have to crimp them in the bush. Most beaver are able to pull the cable out of the W's but sometimes the little ones will noit be able to and will wrap on the top of the poles.
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#2386235 - 01/19/11 08:51 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
Rally,
I don't have a good answer for why the loops are so big other then to say that I was cutting my snare cables at 43" after making the 10" loop the remaining 9 inches was being used to make that loop. That way when the snare was completely open to the loop it was the correct size.

I see what you mean about the adjust able safety cables but are your snare loops adjustable as well? It seems to me that even if the snare loop was made small it could "in theory" still slip off the end of the cable.

I should have been more clear on the ferrules used to support the snare. I crimp them onto the cable but leave the other side open when I build the snares then just slip them onto the wire. No crimping to the wire that way the beaver can easily pull free and hopefully sink away from the ice on the top snares.


Edited by Brandon Yuchasz (01/19/11 08:55 PM)

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#2386388 - 01/19/11 09:34 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
The loops on the snare are set at a fixed size on my spikes. The loop I was referring to was the anchor loop. It has to be small or when the beaver eats the pole, the upper snares can't slide over the bottom two snares and safety cable.
I was looking at your picture and it kinda looked like one side of the double ferrule had been closed and the other looked open. Optical illusion I guess. LOL
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#2395300 - 01/23/11 12:03 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
OK I finally got some snares in the water and had some success. I wanted to thank everyone for their ideas. Here is the set up that connected




Believe it or not I still have a bunch of questions. The spot I set up is close to home and I've been checking it every day, mostly because I was wondering how well the snares would work. First check I caught the beaver on the first of four bait poles. Second check one of the poles was knocked sideways and one of the snares messed up. Third check no action. I'm probably being a little impatient, but I thought I would have done better.

My first question is how often do you guys check your traps and what kind of action do you expect to see. Do you try moving your poles around if the beaver are not going to them after a couple of checks?

I didn't boil my snares in baking soda or anything. Does that make much difference?

Rally, I noticed that you don't make much of a mark on your bait poles and wonder if the marks were bigger, the beaver would see the pole easier or would it just create more snares getting knocked down.

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#2396256 - 01/23/11 06:48 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Not sure if I am seeing it right. But it appears that your bait pole with snares is pretty short. Is that right. Maybe a foot of tree below the snares. That is a pretty good sized tree to have to chew through for the amount of goods they get to carry away. Perhaps they don't like what you have to offer. Especially if they have not begun to eat it up yet. Is it a favorite food species. It looks like our alaska Alder. Which beaver don't care for.
So my first advice would be something smaller in Diameter an more delicious looking. ;0)
_________________________
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#2396569 - 01/23/11 08:04 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
I can see I've got a long way to go. Never crossed my mind that a beavers intent would be to cut a piece off and take it away, just see the white and investigate. The pole is maple, the only other type of tree in the area is alder and that's what I used for 2 of the poles. I guess I'll change things around a little tomorrow. Thanks for the input Family Trapper.

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#2396701 - 01/23/11 08:39 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: crowley]
Brandon Yuchasz Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/30/08
Posts: 45
Loc: Western UP of Michigan
crowley,
The tree does not have to be from the immediate area of the pond. In my area aspen is king for beavers they will eat it first of anything else so I bring the poles in from other area's if there is none near a pond. My catch rate this year is much better using it instead of the alder or other trees near the pond.

Do you have aspen in your area of Maine? If not maybe Rally will chime in on what he is using.

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#2396805 - 01/23/11 09:17 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Dirt Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/01/10
Posts: 210
Loc: Armpit, ak
I will answer your question. Yes I have used this set. Unless you are close to a beavers travel route the set is rather small for eye appeal. A little bait stick underwater in the dark is going to be hard for a beaver to find.I generally use this set as a change up. If I have beaver cutting off bait poles below the snares guarding the pole a couple times, I drop in one of these sets and I almost always have a beaver waiting for me next check. They get used to checking the area where they have been cutting off my poles and getting a free lunch, then they come back to find mister baited conibear waiting for them. No more free lunch! Death by blunt force trauma.
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#2396851 - 01/23/11 09:38 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
We have poplar which is about the same thing. I'm going to cut some around the house tomorrow and try that. I'm glade I decided to set up just one spot until I get things right.

Most of the pictures I've seen of snare poles have been good sized, 4" or so. What Family Trapper had to say has got me thinking, (look out world). When I first looked this spot over there was no visible feed pile so I cut a few holes and put branches in them, (green maple, 1" dia. about 2' long) The next day, they had all been cut off just under the ice. why I didn't keep that in mind when I made the sets???

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#2396996 - 01/23/11 11:06 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Some times it just takes a second mind to get us to refocus. Hope that helped. Poplar in Montana was ice cream to a beaver. Cottonwood is king meal in our country. Let us know how it turns out. I would think slender two inch would be good. Be interested to hear rally comment on this as well.
_________________________
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#2397058 - 01/23/11 11:55 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
I use popple, and prefer it to be about 2.5-3" in diameter, and the best resluts for me have always been when the poles are slick and green. When it starts to get grey and scaley I quit using it. I've used maple I've pulled out of a feedpile, and nothing else was close, but had much better luck after replacing them with fresh popple. The scores should be under each snare, where the loop hangs closest to the pole.
I usually check every third or fourth day depending on weather. I'm usually running three lines, and staying home one day to catch up on skinning and do repairs(snow machine, chisels, chainsaws, my body). Daily checks probably cause as much damage as good, spudding around the house, and I feel my time is better spent setting a new location. Cold spells affect beaver movement, even under ice. The colder it is the less the beaver move. I tend to spend more time setting during cold spells than checking, so I have a bigger line out when the cold spell breaks and beaver movement increases dramatically.
The later in the season the harder beaver work bait poles. What you are offering them is just a fresher piece of what they most likely already have in their feedpile. The later in the year it gets, the longer their feedpile has been under ice and getting slimy. Also if you keep your scores on the poles bright white, they seem to be more attractive/ look fresher.
I try to get on the ice as soon as it will hold me. The beaver are still in the "Gathering mode", and will hit poles to either add them to their feedpile, and to get them out of their runs, where I try to place them , especially early, when I can see them and find them more easily, with thin ice. That works well here until about a week or so before xmas and the beaver seem to go intio a "doldrum period" and it gets hit and miss unless I place them in their runs, and they work them to get them out of the way so their access while they are returning to the lodge with brush in their mouths. This doldrum seems to last about three weeks or so and can be either shorter or longer but usually about three weeks here. I use this excuse to go pheasant hunting. LOL Then it seems the later it gets the better they hit the poles. Now to the middle of March (here)it isn't too hard to catch more than you want to skin. Hardest part is skinning them and making any money from your labor in this current market.Kinda gets in your blood though. Nothing prettier than a february black beaver coming through a couple feet of ice and snow dried.
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#2405804 - 01/28/11 12:48 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
RiversNorth13 Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/04/10
Posts: 863
Loc: Gitche Gumee Wisconsin
GREAT Info.!Thanks to all !
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Simplify your methods to the point of perfection.

Become fast,efficient & effective.

The real "SECRET" to successful trapping.

KEEP IT SIMPLE!

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#2405816 - 01/28/11 01:15 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
akmarten907 Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/27/10
Posts: 50
Loc: Russian Mission, AK
I've used willows(guessing poplar confused ) I've got to give cottonwood a try. I agree that the diameter is a bit big, I've just used about an inch in diameter is all and seems to work good to get them to the snares.
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#2405910 - 01/28/11 06:15 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
Has anyone tried white birch. a house that i set up a couple of days ago was full of chewed sticks, all white birch. Just wondering if it would be a good substitute if poplar wasn't right handy.

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#2405955 - 01/28/11 07:03 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
I have not but I have not ever seen beaver eat them to any extent. Tender young cottenwood before is starts to scale is about as close to the popple Rally is talking about. If you ever find beaver near a grove of cottonwood they go great guns knocking it down.
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2406125 - 01/28/11 09:05 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: crowley]
3 Fingers Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/22/08
Posts: 525
Loc: alaska
Originally Posted By: crowley
Has anyone tried white birch. a house that i set up a couple of days ago was full of chewed sticks, all white birch. Just wondering if it would be a good substitute if poplar wasn't right handy.
Only thing available for my beavers is willow, alder, and birch. I look for a stand of nice white birch about 2" and cut all my bait at one time. I like to nail 2 pieces,cut ends at 45 and 12" long, onto a dry fire killed spruce pole (strong) and use 2 snares.Works well and looking forward to getting some in the next few weeks. I've found the river beavers, that are in murkier water, to be more active and quicker to catch.

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#2406250 - 01/28/11 10:19 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
alaska viking Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/25/07
Posts: 1825
Loc: juneau, alaska
I have seen people use white pvc pipe. Don't think it matters too much.
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#2407066 - 01/28/11 06:52 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: alaska viking]
lorne Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 119
Loc: Manitoba Canada
Originally Posted By: alaska viking
I have seen people use white pvc pipe. Don't think it matters too much.


alaska viking I have tried that here but they just seem to ignore it .
_________________________
Respect the animal ,it was a gift,as was the right to harvest it.


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#2407146 - 01/28/11 07:36 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
lorne Offline
trapper

Registered: 11/20/07
Posts: 119
Loc: Manitoba Canada
I have used the following set when nothing else is working.. I cut a trench about 8-10 ft long in the ice and jam it full of fresh poplar branches /sticks mark them up with an axe.Push them into the mud aways so they have to work to get them .I put a couple of gaps(snare width) in the row with a sturdy dry pole on one side of the gap and a sturdy 3-4 inch poplar stick on the other side. Then I place a sturdy dry pole at each end of the row. I locate the row so it sticks off the lodge like a finger pointing to the feedbed. Leave it a week. Then remove the chewed up poplar. Put fresh stuff in and hang snares on the dry poles at the gaps and on the ends.Whats happens is the beaver have gotten used to feeding around there and going through the gaps and around the ends of the row.
_________________________
Respect the animal ,it was a gift,as was the right to harvest it.


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#2458806 - 02/20/11 08:51 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
I set up a colony the other day, thought I did a good job, at least until I checked it today. I'm hoping someone can tell me what I'm doing wrong.





I had a problem with the beaver chewing the poles off just under the ice and started putting the top snares just under the ice. This pole was chewed off about 2" form the top of the ice. There is about 2' feet of ice here. How he got by the top snares and into the hole is beyond me. When I reset it,I put 2 more snares inside the hole. I don't know if it will work, but it made me feel better anyway.




All the snares have been pulled down tight but there is no kinks in the cable. All of the poles are set in channels. I can't believe a beaver can be that lucky, I've got to be doing something wrong.
This is how the poles were set. The first pole in the photo wasn't touched

I have been catching a few but my catch ratio is low. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated

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#2459021 - 02/20/11 10:23 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Spek Jones Offline
"FATHER"

Registered: 01/10/09
Posts: 812
Loc: Homer, Alaska

I'm not an avid beaver trapper but catch a few each spring, using an armful of brush (birch, cottonwood, or willow, which ever is close) wired
to the pole with three snares set in a triangular pattern around it and
positioned to be just below the ice. Use the upright pole pushed against the bottom of the pond to get a measure to the top of the ice, then use your axe to get a measure from the top of the ice to the bottom of it and
position the snares accordingly. I've always been told that the first
thing they do when they come to the bait is swim a circle around it just below the ice. I've had better results though using the brush for bait
rather than just a pole.
I'd use a heavy dead pole for a cross pole on top though, if they hit your set before it freezes over they will take the whole mess under ice.


Edited by Spek Jones (02/20/11 10:29 PM)

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#2459153 - 02/21/11 12:15 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Crowley,
Your making your holes too large. The beaver are coming up into the holes and chewing your poles. The loops being pulled down that small, are an indication the beaver are knocking them down with their feet as they are working the pole. I cut my holes the size of a 30" chainsaw bar, or about 4"wide and 30" long. If you can pull a caught beaver through the hole without chopping it out, it is too big. The deeper the ice the more important this is.
Are your holes freezing every night? If not the beaver could be pulling the bottom of your pole around, knocking all the snares down, and then cutting the pole. If your ice is declining and the holes aren't freezing, push the bottoms of the pole into the bottom to stabalize them, even if you have to sharpen the bottoms like a pencil point. Then roll your safety cable up tight to the pole on the pole laying on top of the ice, to sabilize the top. They'll still be able to cut the poles, but stabilizing them will make them have to circle the pole a couple times, enhancing your chances of catching them. It is also a good idea to use a dead stick on the top, especially during thin ice periods, in case one gets up on the ice after being caught.
The poles look good, but I've had better luck keeping the loops away from the pole, or so they swing free. If the snare overlaps the pole it will go dead if it drags against the pole while closing.
Some of those loops that are close down to about a two inch diameter may also be beaver pulling their front feet out of stiff loops when they get close to closed. What kind of cable are you using, 7x7 or 1x19?


Edited by Rally (02/21/11 12:21 AM)
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#2459415 - 02/21/11 08:21 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
crowley Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/06/11
Posts: 0
Loc: ME
I'm using 5/64 7x7 with bmi slide free locks. All of those poles were pushed at least 6" into the bottom. If you look at the white birch pole, I put a half hitch in the safety cable at the top of the ice so when I roll the anchor to the bait pole everything stays tight. We had a warm spell and the ice didn't freeze good. I'm sure that didn't help. There were teeth marks at the bottom of all the poles.

dead stick for anchor
make sure bait pole is stable
smaller hole
loops swing free

I'll give that a try, thanks for the input.

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#2459478 - 02/21/11 08:46 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Dirt Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/01/10
Posts: 210
Loc: Armpit, ak
If you have 330 conibears this is your opportunity to drop in one of the sets described earlier in this post. Your on location and the beaver are going to find the 330 set. If your not freezing up at night you have a high probability that a snared beaver is going to come out your hole and not drown. It will then likely have snare damage.

I would add to the above recommendations by crowley that you try using a thicker bait pole say 3 or 4 inches diameter at the top. Something that would take more than a few bites to cut off. This should keep them working and swimming around your snares longer.
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#2459516 - 02/21/11 09:02 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
scootermac Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/03/08
Posts: 165
Loc: Northern Manitoba
I second Dirts choice, if you have them set a couple of 330's with bait on the jaws. Works great.

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#2581954 - 05/15/11 11:18 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Otter04 Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 742
Loc: Westerlo, New York
its called a hanging suzy or a swinging suzy. the set works .thorpe showed that set in his under ice video. its been around for more yrs than anyone can remember.....what i dont like is poeple dont give credit to those they learned it from..so sad.

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#2582030 - 05/16/11 04:10 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
If the set has been around for years do you think that quite possibly many have learned it from someone else besides in Thorpe's video. I am sure there has been many a trapper that has hung bait off a 330 without ever hearing the name Thorpe. Rather a harsh comment to think that everyone learned and new of Thorpe.
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2582258 - 05/16/11 09:32 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Family Trapper]
yukonjeff Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/02/08
Posts: 823
Loc: M.T.V. Alaska
NEVER use green poles to attach your snares..or the same thing will happen time after time..thats beaver snaring 101

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#2582629 - 05/16/11 03:45 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Dale Torma Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1103
Loc: Northern MN
Good tutorial and discussion! I learn a bit every time from threads like this.

I have used the "trapeze" set ( baited conibear suspended by 2 wires) for years, and learned it from an old-timer who learned it from who knows who. Then learned it again from Johnny Thorpe last year in Wisc.

I only had Belisle 280's, and to get good head catches, I baited the bottom jaws or between them (With quite a little bundle of poplar) left the trigger wires on top, bent to a small coathanger shape about 3 - 4 inches wide by 1 inch deep, so the beaver would grab the bait and bump the trigger with the top of its head or neck while trying to swim away (through the trap) with the bait. I had and still have great success, and now prefer a 280, cause you get a neck catch, no fur damage and smaller hole to chop. caught many, many beavers of all sizes this way . when I first tried this type of set, I baited the trigger and had approx.30% snapped traps. I think the beaver was upright in the water and the closing trap pushed it away. tying bait to the jaws and using a small or offset trigger forces them to really get into the trap before firing. I even went so far as to have the trigger on the farthest side away from the expected approach. I cannot honestly remember a miss after changing to small triggers and bait wired to the bottom. A 330 you would not need such a small trigger because of the jawspread, but I still make them small or offset too.

I do my snare sets very different from Rally's and have lots of success with my method too. no bait just guarding the feed pile and runways with swivelled 10 inch loop snares. works better for me than baited snares. Each to their own.

anyway thats how I do it similarly to the above methods.

difficult to attribute particular sets to any one individual. May have been re-invented many times without knowing what other people were doing. It is a tough thing to say So and so invented this, when we really don't know who may have. I also learned my snare setting from a neighbor, who learned it from a guy in Alaska.

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#2582731 - 05/16/11 05:42 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Quote:
NEVER use green poles to attach your snares..or the same thing will happen time after time..thats beaver snaring 101


Well that is exactly what Rally does and mentors others to do and I would venture to say is probably one of the best beaver trappers there is.
He catches more beaver in a year than most trappers do in a lifetime. Must be something to it. I have not mastered the method for sure but from what I know about Rally I wouldn't be to quick to throw stones at the set.
The guy is a beaver trapping professional and has spent a lot of time working on figuring out how to do it. But he does teach a more advanced course than beaver 101 however. ;0)

Rally's setup that he has well documented on this thread.





Edited by Family Trapper (05/16/11 05:44 PM)
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2582736 - 05/16/11 05:45 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Top Jimmy Offline
"Assistant Speling Zcar"

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 4555
Loc: Alaska, USA
I think there is a bit of a difference here. The snares might be "attached" to the bait pole, but in the end, I belive that most folks then secure the entire thing on a dead pole above the ice so that it doesn't disapear below. I know that is what we do. Snares are attached just under the ice to the bait pole, and if it is a deep hole, then we might attach another set of snares below the first.

-TJ
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#2582738 - 05/16/11 05:47 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Dale
Quote:
I think the beaver was upright in the water and the closing trap pushed it away. tying bait to the jaws and using a small or offset trigger forces them to really get into the trap before firing.

i think you are on to something here.
I wonder what would happen if you put the coni right under the ice and horizonal with the bait in the middle. That way it might force him into position better as his body might be more vertical? Just a thought.
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Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2582853 - 05/16/11 07:05 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: Otter04]
drasselt Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/17/10
Posts: 7
Loc: Alaska
Originally Posted By: Otter04
its called a hanging suzy or a swinging suzy. the set works .thorpe showed that set in his under ice video. its been around for more yrs than anyone can remember.....what i dont like is poeple dont give credit to those they learned it from..so sad.

You sure bout that? We used that in the early 80's but had a lot of empty fired traps. One day we found a dead beaver free floating near a fired 330 and quit using it not knowing how many other beaver had been killed but not held by the trap.

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#2583323 - 05/17/11 07:01 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Dale Torma Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1103
Loc: Northern MN
Rally has surely perfected his methods of snaring, I'm pretty good at beaver snaring, but could learn a thing or two from Mr. Rally Hess.

Drasselt, I only had fired empty traps when I was baiting the triggers, When I changed to bait tied to one jaw and a very small trigger I never had the problem again.

I have caught beaver using a quarter of a potatoe and even a slice of beaver tail exposing the white flesh (2 in one day by the nose in belisle 160's set for muskrats with beaver tail bait because the muskrats were eating the beaver tails on a three day check.) not very big beaver in the 160's though.

I like belisle 280's for baited under ice sets, but that is as small of a trap as I would go. I use a 10 to 12 inch loop for my beaver snaring under ice, with 3/32 1X19 swivel snares. I like them for my method, no snare mark and you can usually re-use the snare many times. never catch otter in the stiff snares though.

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#2584352 - 05/18/11 06:07 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Quote:
I belive that most folks then secure the entire thing on a dead pole above the ice so that it doesn't disapear below.

Now I would agree that would be 101. Sure would be fun to get some underwater video of beaver working a baited pole.
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Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2584402 - 05/18/11 07:28 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
One way I have done with my 330's is to run them with one spring up and one down. It is secured on a dead pole, because when I used green ones I have had them chewed in two without a fired trap. I bait them with either a green scraped stick wired to the jaw.

With that said I am more successful with the trapeze way...that is how I first started and continue.

Baiting with a pvc is somthing I want to try yet.

I do however want to try more snaring !!!

As far as snaring.....What locks should I use. Family Trapper...I saw in your photos using washer type. Are you happy how they work ?



Edited by On a Call (12/11/11 08:47 PM)

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#2584762 - 05/18/11 03:19 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Dale Torma Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1103
Loc: Northern MN
I have good luck with washer locks, no sharp edges to cut fur. Also Keiper locks work well for me, no sharp angles or edges facing the fur. don't particularly care for cam-locks. also small sharp edged locks sometimes cut guard hair. I have and still use plain "L" locks but grind the edges round. I wish someone would make the old Kleffman lock (Kleflock), they work good for everything, the bear sized was the best drowner lock ever for me. I still have a few on my old no 14's and they dont wear out like a crunchproof swivel (the hole getting wore out by cable.) been re-using old kleffman locks for 34 years.

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#2879837 - 12/11/11 06:07 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
This is too good not to archive or at least keep alive. TTT
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2880032 - 12/11/11 09:33 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
We can do either
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#2880207 - 12/11/11 12:15 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Boco Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/08/11
Posts: 353
Loc: james bay frontierOnt.
I have used snare poles both dry(fire killed) with bait and green with safety wire.However after trapping with a couple of professional big number under ice beaver trappers I have adopted their methods of using conibears under ice at den entrance.First use hollow aluminum pike pole to locate the MAIN entrance bysounding with pole.The hollow pole will amplify the distict difference in sound from the air bubbles at the entrance.Open hole with chain saw or chisel(depending on activity)If the entrance is very wide,(which is often the case)set two or three traps side by side with block sticks so as one beaver cannot spring two traps.No other fencing is necessary.Out in front(away from the house)where the channel narrows set one or two more traps.Many times we have rolled up to a house after two or three days and have removed 3 or 4 beaver.If channel is narrow all the way out from house set two or three traps a couple feet apart in channel.Beaver will be caught coming and going from house in either direction.One check and then pull.Under good conditions 2 guys can set up to 20 houses in a day.You will need a good snow machine and large deep sleigh to carry traps and stands.this is a very efficient way to catch beaver.

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#2881035 - 12/11/11 08:46 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
Brings back memories untill we get good ice down here...which should be next week.

Personally I like hitting the runs by hanging one or two 330's side by side off at least a 2" inch pole. I use just rebar wire to do the hanging. The traps are hung into the run about 4-6 inches off the bottom. I might use 1" sticks to stable the traps a bit by shoving the sticks through the springs into the mud, but I have just allowed them to hang also with good results also.

I will either chop a hole or often there no ice above the run. The pole is laid perpendicular to the run and the traps hang off the pole. Some time I trap close to a lodge other times I am 20 yards away.

I do not understand the above use of a pole for sounding (?) to locate runs, I just look for thin ice or chop till I find them. If there is a more easy way...let me onto it. Time is time.

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#2881049 - 12/11/11 08:54 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
2 guys couldn't set up 3 houses in a day in my country. How much ice are you talking about Boco ?
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#2881249 - 12/11/11 10:49 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Boco Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/08/11
Posts: 353
Loc: james bay frontierOnt.
Around an active house even in january the ice is usually no more than 18" thick in the main run where as out in the lake it might be 4 ft.Most of the beaver trapping here is done on creeks 30 ft wide or less with ponds in series.Some areas south of us have very good beaver habitat but once you get into the james bay lowlands they are much further apart however winter travel is good.Are most of your beaver on big rivers White? I stay off the big rivers too risky.Lakes are usually OK to travel if you have a good machine that can handle the slush,and watch out for pressure cracks on the big lakes.Some medium size lakes can have a couple or three active colonys if the feed(poplar)is there.In march some good catches can be made as sometimes there is little or no ice at the run.You can see the run under the snow as the snow melts into the water and a distinct groove will show in the snow(learned this the hard way by steppin in)


Edited by Boco (12/11/11 10:55 PM)

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#2881270 - 12/11/11 11:10 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
Yeah my beavers are almost all on the river. Like you I won't travel on the river. Mine is far too risky for more than a couple hundred yards at a time. Lots of bad spots and open holes.

By the time beaver here will take a bait we usually have 2-4 feet of ice. Of course you can't see anything below about 2 inches in the water so that doesn't help a lot.

The avaiable food is slim in my area so the houses may be several miles apart and you have to travel the tundra and come at them from cross country to get to them. Lots of breaking trail. Sometimes I even have to cut bait elswhere and haul it where I want to use it.
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#2881327 - 12/12/11 12:42 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Quote:
I do not understand the above use of a pole for sounding (?) to locate runs, I just look for thin ice or chop till I find them. If there is a more easy way...let me onto it. Time is time.


I trapped beaver in Montana. It is cold there for the lower 48. But I had to learn how to trap beaver all over again up here under the ice. Circumstances are a lot different. Depending on our freeze up beaver trapping ponds can set up with or without tell tail signs of where beaver runs are. Just too much foggy ice.
Worst I have ever seen it this year. I am an entrance trapping guy. Usually looking for bait more than anything. I will take any beaver I can. Entrances are deadly and if you start early can be found easily. The longer you wait the more ice that builds over the runs. Thunking along the perimeter of the house can tell you a lot. You will learn to hear the thud of a more hollower ice above the runways. This year the ice is so rotten and slushed up due to early snow and lack of ice that it is a mess.

When it get too deep to find these I use a method walking around the house and diving my chainsaw blade vertically into the ice every 18 inches in likely spots around the perimeter of the house. You can quite quickly isolate the thinner ice and thus the entrance to the house this way. From there your home free.
I need some beaver for bait this year and am just going to wait and set up baited conibears after they get hungry since conditions are so lousy this year and my time is short.


Edited by Family Trapper (12/12/11 12:43 AM)
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Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2881444 - 12/12/11 05:50 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
I thought about using the above method with the white PVC on the trigger. Saw your photo W17 I just wonder how well it will work here on early ice.

FT I thought his method was bit differant for sounding. Thank you for setting me straight. I too use my axe or chainsaw to find the runs. And if you are in the runs no need for bait :), although it might increase your odds ??


Edited by On a Call (12/12/11 05:55 AM)

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#2883425 - 12/13/11 02:56 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
shorthair Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/24/06
Posts: 1145
Loc: Maine
Wow, talk about a life time of education in an hour or so. Great info. Thanks!!!!!!!!!!

If the day time temps ever stay below 40 we may start building ice. Just enough of a shorline skin to prevent foot holds and not enough to even think about getting out on.

It may have been stated already on one of the nine pages, if so, sorry for the repeat, but do you guys believe the feed bed "spoils" later on in the season and fresh baited snares and 330's are even more productive or are they as good early? Thanks.
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"My biggest worry is that my wife (when I'm dead) will sell my traps for what I said I paid for them."

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#2883430 - 12/13/11 03:32 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Family Trapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/23/06
Posts: 2087
Loc: Homer, Alaska
Shorthair that is precisely why I surfaced this thread. It is golden!
What new and long time trapper can learn on a thread like this is just that. A life time of trapping experience. There is not better resource in my mind that the trappers here willing to share what it has taken years to accomplish. New trappers are truly blessed to have this site.

I have not found bait to be of any consistent use before Jan or later. The later the better.


Edited by Family Trapper (12/13/11 03:35 AM)
_________________________
Passion- There are some people who live in a dream world, and their are some who face reality; and then there are those who turn one into the other.

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#2883545 - 12/13/11 07:05 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
I agree with FT, Shorthair and you hit it with the statement regarding spoils. However I would not use the word spoil more than I would use this annology, the cream of the crop is gone and when a nice new white branch appears it's like fresh bread out of the oven.

As far as more productive ? That depends if you are talking about baited traps/snares vs run trapping. IMO winter is the best time to bait but runs are still very productive.

Good


Edited by On a Call (12/13/11 07:13 PM)

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#2890317 - 12/16/11 03:19 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Tradbow1 Offline
trapper

Registered: 12/15/11
Posts: 50
Loc: AK
Thanks for posting this....I have a hut I'd like to try my hand at snaring beaver...spent most of yesterday reading it...thanks again!

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#2891738 - 12/17/11 05:39 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Dale Torma Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1103
Loc: Northern MN
I re-read this and learned a few things I missed the first time, now I am thinking about winter trapping a flowage after Christmas time. This thread has re-inspired the insane desire to chop ice and catch beaver! ;0)

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#2893227 - 12/17/11 11:40 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Boco Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/08/11
Posts: 353
Loc: james bay frontierOnt.
Another tip to get you on the entrance.When you roll up to a beaver house look for the side of the house that has a more gradual slant from top to ice level.most of the time the entrance will be on the side of the house with the slant as opposed to the straiter side.

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#2894915 - 12/18/11 09:02 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
Boco...I am not sure I understand you comment ?

The more steep the slope or angle the more likely the entrance is there ? Or the other way ?

Seems like most of my lodges are all equal .


Edited by On a Call (12/19/11 07:33 AM)

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#2894997 - 12/18/11 09:30 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
I'm pretty sure he means the other way. The more gentle the slope into the water is often the side where the entrance is
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#2895036 - 12/18/11 09:50 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Boco Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/08/11
Posts: 353
Loc: james bay frontierOnt.
Yes what white said.Its not 100% but is a good indicator when the house is configured that way.

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#2895198 - 12/18/11 11:45 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
I'd agree with that Boco, on bank denning beaver or river beaver, but not so much with pond beaver.Usually runs going up onto pond beaver houses are located at the most shallow water or on the same side as the feedpile, because that is most often where they get the material to build the lodge, and replace that material with the feedpile.
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#2895431 - 12/19/11 07:43 AM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
I never noticed this indication but then perhaps my beaver are sky scapers builders with most of them in ponds ? BOCO, White and Rally thank you for the leason though and I will use that info on the next lodge

Rally I do agree with you as I tend to find entrances heading towards the feed pile or at most at a 90 degree angle and have yet to find on at a 180 degree but I have found back and side doors.

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#2898186 - 12/20/11 02:32 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Boco Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/08/11
Posts: 353
Loc: james bay frontierOnt.
Good point Rally. Most of the ponds in this area start out as bank beaver on a creek or small river and over time become a flooded pond.The slope of the house indicates where the original channel is under the water,thus usually the deepest water,and main entrance.Speaking of feed beds we found one at a house this week that measured 128 ft(went back with tape and measured it) out from the house,the largest feed bed I have heard of in this area.

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#2898203 - 12/20/11 02:42 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
white17 Offline

"General (Mr.Sunshine) Washington"

Registered: 03/17/07
Posts: 14669
Loc: McGrath, AK
WOW ! That guy is prepared for winter !
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Mean As Nails

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#2898921 - 12/20/11 07:58 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
On a Call Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/23/10
Posts: 969
Loc: S/E Mich - N/W Ohio
I am thinking he had a lot of help putting up all those greens.

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#2899338 - 12/20/11 10:33 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Rally Offline
trapper

Registered: 02/14/09
Posts: 172
Loc: Hill City,Mn.
Boco,
How deep is the water where that big feedpile is located? If it is shallow and heavy ice later, that big, but shallow feed pile may not be enough.
I snared a shallow hard bottom pond like that once. The otter bored a hole in the dam and the water levl dropped about two feet. The pond was only about 5 feet deep to start with and had about 25 inches of ice. The beaver were chewing out of the ice next to the house where the ice receeded and they were eating the tops of the feed pile above the ice. They were pretty easy to catch I snared two on the ice and the third one went to the timber wolves. I should have know better.
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Keep your boots dry

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#2899368 - 12/20/11 10:58 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Boco Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/08/11
Posts: 353
Loc: james bay frontierOnt.
Rally,the water up here is usually no more than 5 feet deep in any pond due to the flat landscape,some may be 8feet but not too often.Water often drops in mid winter as the bush runoff gets locked up.The majority of beaver seem to do alright when the water drops as the ice usually hangs up on the feed bed and they seem to access it.In the past I have trapped beaver in Jan.and the only place there was water was at the entrance.We had a week of about 50below c.and by the time I retrieved the beaver I was hauling blocks of ice in my sleigh.lol.The only time I have seen beaver chew out is usually late winter and invariably thru the air vent on top of the house.When I trap these beaver they are starving and usually only have willow and spruce for feed.As for the big feed bed we have not set it up yet, we are just now breaking trail for marten.The house is of average size.


Edited by Boco (12/20/11 11:03 PM)

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#2908694 - 12/25/11 09:37 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
POWER SNARER Offline
trapper

Registered: 05/25/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Manitoba Canada
got a question
i checked a house today and it has a frost ring and i know theres beaver in there the problem is that under the 10 inches of ice there is 10 inches of water it is deep on a different side of the lodge but it is nowhere near the feed bed
should i set snares (or 330s) there or just gie up on the house and get it during ce out come spring
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#2908718 - 12/25/11 09:54 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
Boco Offline
trapper

Registered: 08/08/11
Posts: 353
Loc: james bay frontierOnt.
Locate the main entrance and set two or three 330's.

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#2908720 - 12/25/11 09:55 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: POWER SNARER]
TheFurTrapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 33
Loc: Manitoba, Canada
Originally Posted By: POWER SNARER
got a question
i checked a house today and it has a frost ring and i know theres beaver in there the problem is that under the 10 inches of ice there is 10 inches of water it is deep on a different side of the lodge but it is nowhere near the feed bed
should i set snares (or 330s) there or just gie up on the house and get it during ce out come spring


i'd say, if you absolutly wanted to trap it now you'd have to use a 330. Pretty hard to set snare poles in 10 inches of water. The beaver don't pay much attention to snare poles this early anways it seems. I'd wait till spring on that house though myself.
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#2908733 - 12/25/11 10:05 PM Re: Under ice beaver/conibear? [Re: TrapperTy]
TheFurTrapper Offline
trapper

Registered: 01/28/10
Posts: 33
Loc: Manitoba, Canada
Here's my favorite way of Under Ice Trapping Beaver.

Top of my hand represents where the ice is.


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YouTube Trapline Video's:
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