They're getting batty in Cincinnati!
Who's starting to get lots of calls...I know someone is.

Get lots of them everyday LT? 20-30 daily in ohio alone. Here is my link for Cincinatti http://www.usanimalcontrol.com/cincinnat...-fox-cyote.html

I got two calls yesterday

here's one i've been working on



the reason i don't use spray foam if it could be exposed to the elements another company did an exclusion on this house 5-6 years ago and their foam job has failed plus it looks ugly imho to have foam hanging out of the house

It has been the craziest bat year ever.... weird how in some areas (besides the northeast affected by WNS) some guys are way down on calls. I've been doing inspections since early June when the calls were already constant. My fall bat work schedule is half full already.... not a bad problem to have! Starting next week as the young are flying at all areas I am monitoring.

I agree with the foam comment above..... I haven't used it for several years now, as I was doing a lot of follow-up bat work where other companies used only foam for sealing, and as it deteriorated from weather bats would return into the structures. In my opinion it only has about a 2 year lifespan outdoors. It also will "fall out" after a single winter if the structure experiences much contraction and expansion due to temps. Another thing I have seen is female bats actually chewing through foam if they were excluded before the young could fly. (No, not from personal experience)

I use caulk for the small gaps (often with backer), and cobra-vent for large gaps, often covering all sealed areas with metal trims. Yep, it takes longer and costs more, but if anyone thinks bat work is fast money they aren't doing it right.

I am passing on them to Play in CO,,,,,,,,,,

Did catch a Bunch of trout.............

Foam sealing with pageris foam with copper stuff it backer or cobra vent material with silicone glazing over the foam will ensure many years of life on smaller void seal areas.

However, if one doesnt glaze the foam it will deteriate in a few years and turn to powder little by little from UV exposure.I have seen bats chew foam several times over the years when used at primary entry points as a stand alone sealant.

The phone is ringing really well in IN, could be my best bat season ever if it keeps up. I am sure glad to see others using cobra vent I am planning on using some on an exclusion that I dont want to spend a week with the break on. I have never heard of anyone else using it before and thought I had made a brilliant discovery lol. I guess I should have joined this forum a long time ago.

bob that is exactly what has happen to the foam in the pictures i posted just turning to dust so i've been sealing it all with aluminum cut to fit close to the stone profile and clauking the joint

Why not use types N Mortar.....??` It does not need to be face sealed...Color can be added......And is what is missing
It can be applied using a mortar bag and tooled within a hour or so depending on the temp.....

LT, just came back from a "bat in a bedroom" call. You're right, it's that time of year again.

Did 3 bat inspections yesterday....110 degrees in those attics at 3 in the afternoon!!!

Unreal amount of bat calls! Had to add two guys part time who I used to work with at CC just to keep up with bat pre-exclusion work and no let up on coon calls and starting to get baby squirrels again. Did an interview today with news 5 for bats and was quoted in a news 12 bat interview last night, unfortunately we were miss quoted, average bat seal up is between $600 and $3000 they used that price for the cost of clean up and we have a few clean up's over that, so just waiting for the irate calls. Getting calls from Robb R as well and have noticed that the girls have to spend less time on phone with customer explaining the process before we set up appointment.(Thanks Robb!) We use no foam unless it is backer rod and if you have not tried it, Solar Seal #900 is a great sealant/adhesive for bat work! www.npcsealants.com

Okay here's a great tip for all you bat guys. This is how to completely avoid call backs on bat jobs. My son went to bid on a bat exclusion today that one of our competitors bid at $2000.00. There wasn't a bat anywhere on the property. No chance of a call-back on that job!

how exactly do the bats chew the foam? I know the foam deteriorate and it will eventually fall apart and/or out.

But how do the bats chew the foam out, like are you finding bats with foam in their mouth or what?

below the exit 2 dollar that is bat chew

Coonwild....Are you applying clear caulking in the first picture ?

The second picture what's the sealant on the left ?

it's what the company that makes it calls transluscent second pic is aluminum cut to fit the stone profile and than caulked

what do you mean? below the exit? are you saying there is a entry exit point and you are finding the foam dust or what.

I do not believe that bats can chew through foam.

I NEED ENFO on bat exclusion,cleanup,with price examples

Look, Jameson is at the NTA. Who on here can post some pic's.

Vinke???

Bats can and do chew on foam...some foams anyway. I have had the bat cones and extruders chewed on over the past few years. Not enough to allow re-entry, but definately chewed on.

I have pics on my old machine but can't get to them now.

james jackson-
If you don't get the information you are looking for here; a three year ADVANCED SEARCH on the ADC Forum for bats will bring up 200 replys. Other SEARCHES will bring up additional information

Robb Russell at http://www.wildlifepro.net/ has a lot of information available. Even has podcasts on the subject.

In that case I would suggest not listening to anything you read on any wildlife control message boards. Odd that you are looking for info (at no cost, I might add) and when you are provided info that will save you about 10 years on the learning curve you decide to go against a few people with about 100 years of combined experience. They don't chew foam very often... BUT they will if there are young inside or it is at an established primary access point. Maybe this paragraph will "sink in" if you read it about 5 times. Just some constructive criticism.... not a personal attack. Or you can refuse to listen and become one of those companies that many of us will follow-up and actually solve the bat problem for the client.



That is a short question that would require an encyclopedia-sized volume of textbooks to answer. Short version: Bat exclusion = seal EVERY potential entry point on the ENTIRE structure. Install one-way excluders at the main openings. Remove after a week or 2 and seal final holes. Cost varies due to structure size, design, condition, materials/labor, travel, difficulty of access to perform work (boom lifts, etc), and many other factors. Cost??? Range from $300 to $30,000 or more, depending on previous conditions.

Clean-outs: Same deal... size, access, equipment, quantity, travel, time/labor, disposal, safety measures required. Cost??? $250 to $25,000 or more.

There are some good places to learn bat work.... one is the workshop by Eric Arnold:
http://www.batsbirdsandmore.com/training.htm

No substitute for trial and error.... learning by experience is best, but most will give up on bat work before they make it through the learning period. Great persistence is required, and the ability to "learn" from a critter that weighs 1/2 ounce.

RON SCHELLER,LA.TRAPPER,thanks so much for the info,I understand that was a big question,yes I have read some of the info on wildlifepro,havent got to all the podcast yet,thanks again

Ok.............thanks for the info !

""In that case I would suggest not listening to anything you read on any wildlife control message boards. Odd that you are looking for info (at no cost, I might add) and when you are provided info that will save you about 10 years on the learning curve you decide to go against a few people with about 100 years of combined experience. They don't chew foam very often... BUT they will if there are young inside or it is at an established primary access point. Maybe this paragraph will "sink in" if you read it about 5 times. Just some constructive criticism.... [b]not a personal attack. Or you can refuse to listen and become one of those companies that many of us will follow-up and actually solve the bat problem for the client[/b].""

Well for not being a personal attack it was sure sarcastic enough. I was just stating my opinion and asking for more information. And like I said, I would like to see how you know. Thats all, no reason to get any panties in a bunch or start questioning my ability to do exclusions.

On the same note, so do you think they can chew through silicone?

Under the right circumstances, YES.

My calls are up 3 times from last year. I hate doing bats by the end of September, but cant wait for them to start for the calls in June.

They are, in essence the BIG MONEY makers!

I agree... I read my response again.... and TODAY it does sound like I had a bit of attitude going. Probably one of those high-stress days where it only took one more thing to trigger a postal service moment. Unlike today when I'm worn to a frazzle... Two days of bat-proofing up near Peoria on a 2-story log home. Drove up Friday afternoon and stayed in Pekin, and started Saturday morning at 6 AM and finished Saturday night at 11 PM, then drove 2.5 hours home. Bats coming out the excluders as I was installing them. Always neat. These 16 and 18 hour days are killing me. Bat season..... yep.

Regarding the silicone.... I've never seen them even try to chew it, but have no idea if they would be successful. I do know they HATE the smell, as I have them fly out during the day when using it along soffit channels or other areas right near their roost areas. They chatter like crazy as soon as the smell gets to them, and a few will sometimes actually leave in the daylight. Seems like if they hate it that much it would be unlikely that they would chew on it.... unless somehow they were sealed in by it?

Ron, this is my question, how do they chew through the foam? If you run a nice even bead at say a dormer connection how do they get ahold of it to chew? I would guess if you do an extra sloppy job applicating foam they would have a much better chance. We use foam as little as possible, I prefer silicone, mortar,aluminum and cedar but we use foam in certain applications. Im not questioning wether they do or dont just how.

Wow what a busy thread and lots of input here.

Its not only about if bats can chew through foam but its other species as well that will allow future access for bats at a later date.

Foam is too general of a word and that crap from Home Depot, Lowes, called Great Stuff and marketed under other names is in its own category. Todol marketed by WCS is the only foam I will use. But my preferences are using metal, wood, backer rod, and silicone where and when ever possible. When a exclusion is done right our work should match the present building ,transparent and not stand out as that spot the bat guy created up there.

I find foam does not weather well over time and creates a problem down the road, animals and birds love picking away at it. Do bats chew away foam ?? No, maybe, does it even matter; but, squirrels, raccoons, birds do and open up the cavity for bats again. Bob Jameson is right on the money about Foam by itself turning to dust and not one customer wants to pay down the road for a redo that could of been prevented the first time around.

I agree on the other animals thing, any time I see where something has chewed foam it usually was not chewed but pecked by either sparrows or starlings. Dormer connections are the usual suspect and they get thier fair share of squirrel chews but raccoons usually rip things open and foam or no foam it doesnt matter with them. Where I like to use foam (todol) is on brick buildings with the wood trim on top that covers the brick cuts. Most of the time there is a substancial gap and needs something to fill a void after it is set up we cover it up with caulk. I do know if foam is exposed to sunlight for an extended period of time it goes fast, the UV rays I guess. When I first started this I thought foam was the silver bullet for all things and went through several cases a year but now I dont buy it by the case because it usually freezes in the garage over the winter and I do 100 times the work now than when I started. My thing is with foam is it looks bad and unproffessional. I dont know if bats chew it or not but there are several people on here that say yes I would just like to know how to tell if it was bats chewing because I may have seen it before and not known what I was looking at.

Travis without a trail cam photo we will never know honestly whether bats chew foam or not.Hopefully they are not inside to try to chew out or die though.

Yes, and a bat can chew, don't think they can't !

million dollar question.... DO BATS CHEW THROUGH SILICONE? ive thought about this, i always do a follow up on my work to make sure its holding to what i had said, my word is crucial in this line of work. ive been told its mice that chew through it.. ill get a pic of one if i can on my next job... anyone else have a photo of it?

I have seen bats chew through a primary twice that was sealed with pageris foam by two different new trainee's after teaching them to never do that with no backer material, copper or other means of entry deterrent.This was done as a stand alone material and bats did make reentry within 6 weeks of the original seal.

It was not a squirrel chew in or bird pecking hole as the hole was too small for either to make entry.I also witnessed another primary seal job done prematurely after dark kind of thing by a consumer with great stuff that had bats chew out as the chewed off debris was laying inside the dormer area on the floor of the attic.

I have never seen a silicone seal area breached by bats in my 30 some years. Squirrels yes, in the winter, then in the spring the bats found the opening and re entered the old roost site.


This was done many years ago before I began doing any documentation with photo support. Mice can and do chew foam as well if used as a stand alone material.Mice do climb and run roofs more then many probably realize but the points of entry were bat primaries and easily accessed in dormer corners to allow easy chew access.

It would most definately be easy to see great stuff on the attic floor, thats a good point I will have to keep my eyes peeled for that sort of thing. Bob I have to respect your oppinion you have been in buisness 3 times as long as me and have most likely seen lots of bats in your time. I get a few call backs but mostly on jobs that I should have turned down, you know houses that need a match or a wrecking ball and not a bat exclusion. I always call those jobs the day when 2 fools met, them for paying a rediculous ammount of money and me for taking it they always end up being a pain in the rear. But when someone waves 8 or 10k at you its hard to say no lol.

Things can happen on any bat job with respects to an area not appearing as needing attention or is not visible. Then just to find out later that it was a place you suspected but didnt seal. All you can do is go back and fix the problem.

I have had some real good projects over the years where it seems $$$ isnt an object. We all in time run into a few of those.What is that old saying the "Customer is always right?"Gotta make them happy.

My two cents here.

I try to look at a call back as a training opportunity and with the attitude that no critter is smarter then me.I find critters my best teachers and never happy until I win- not them.

I find the call back worth thousands of dollars to me in a positive sense.I have a chance with each call back to learn something new each time and the chance to show the customer I stand behind my work.

A happy, satisfied customer who can tell their friends.

Thursday, I got a "routine bat in the house call."
Friday, I get several calls from the same lady who notices a "bite mark" on her arm and doesn't know how it got there.
Friday night, I get a call from University Hospital, who says they are going ahead with rabies shots, dispite, I still have the bat.

Robb, if call backs are worth thousands of dollars, some of my guys must be millionaires.

Paul this only works if they really do learn from them lol

Whos doing strictly bat seal-up now? Anyone?

Basically nothing but bats for the past 4 weeks, and a full bat schedule for at least the next 4 weeks. Still getting 3 to 5 calls a day.... will most likely be several I can't get to before hibernation, but will seal and mount excluders, leaving in place until after the spring warm-up. Been giving all the squirrel, skunk, and coon calls to other guys I know fairly close who don't mess with bat work. Can't afford to chase the "regular" critters when the bat schedule is out of control. Short days are 12 hours, but most are 16 at this point.... a few 18. It's killing me... but only lasts a couple months.

Ditto what Ron says. I have been in 3 states in the last 3 weeks working. Going back to Maryland and W.Va. for commercial bat work this week again for our second go round in these states.

I am looking forward to the frosts and freeze coming to stop this madness.Time to think about trapping and bottling for the winter stock inventory.

We turn down or table all small animal work this time of year. Have done this for many years now when we start venting bats. When you balance the scale small animal work is a waste of time during these times factoring in the avg return income per job and time vested.

Same here! I was laying on a HOT roof last week installing an excluder at a dormer corner..... heat coming through the rug I had placed on the shingles.... sweat burning my eyes. When I closed my eyes to relieve the burning sensation, I suddenly had an image of chopping through 4 inches of ice to set muskrat conibears...... can't wait!

Ron, yesterday the temperature stayed in the fifties all day. This is certainly the coldest summer I can ever remember. It's almost noon and our thermometer says 59 degrees. It's hard to believe we live in adjoining states.

I have had nites at 49 and 51 degrees in the last week. Took another ride to Maryland to inspect another resort site today for a another bat job and the high was 62 there today.Normally in the mid 80's. The nites are cooling down quickly as an avg for this time of year. It may mean our bat season here is winding down quickly particularly in the higher elevation and water front areas.

The hot roof adventure was a couple weeks ago..... the past week has been awesome for bat work. Highs around 75, lows at night around 55. I'll take all this stuff we can get.....

Question on bats in the winter time do they leave the builings or just hibernate or go to warmer regions to hibernate.

some do both according to my experience over 20 some years.If thermal conditions are suitable for some bats they will stay in summer habitat while others instinctively migrate to winter hibernacula where others congregate as well.

Multiples that stay will cluster together for warmth then move in and out of the cluster as their needs for warmth dictate.Usually at the wintering time of year most will drop closer to the lower floors from the attic and/or the interior wall spaces to take advantage of the thermal output loss of the the structure.

This is usually in insulation where they can reduce body heat loss. I have found many bats over the years as singles and cluster groups during Dec, Jan, and Feb clean outs which bear out my findings.

I am sure this is common place in our region where our winters are not as harsh as say Minnesota or the more northern regions of the country.

Most likely the southern more temperate regions of the country have resident bat colonies that winter year round within local structures.

I use both the bat cones and bat excluders sold by WCS.....I have never found a place I couldn't use them effeciantly. They look professional and work....why not use them? They are re-usable also. I have some in use right now that I have had for at least 5 years, used over and over.

Nothing wrong with the others being made or uased, but these are to easy to use for me not to use them.

thanks bob now I have learn something new today

if you dont buy or run out of cones, you can use gutter down spout for bat cones.

I have also made valves out of hardware cloth and copper stuff-it!

Anyone catching any specie of bats beside BROWNS?

I am not catching any, but am evicting a bunch. We don't have Little Brown Bats here. Most, probably 80%, are Freetails. Most colonies do contain a few Big Brown Bats and even fewer may contain a some Evening Bats. Once in a while, all three species are found in the same colony. Our bats fly 12 months of the year. I only do emergency removals during June and July. It does take a little longer to complete a job during the colder months.

I find it very interesting to hear of experiences from various parts of the country

I have caught some Red bats in houses..which I hear is unusual.

I only seen one red bat in my life and I believe he was a transient that was migrating. Lucky for me he was hanging out in a gable vent when I arrived to look for an opossum. He was gone the next day when I returned to do the bat exclusion.

Euderma maculatum
Myotis evotis
Myotis yumanensis
and a few more lol........with 5-16 species of bats....ya never know who you will meet.!

i just picked up my largest bat job of the season here a few days ago. just bat proofing and exclusion. my calls have really dropped off but considering this is my first year at it, and i only advertise in papers ive done exceptionally well. I just picked up a HUGE gopher and mole job yesterday. lets just hope i get some more calls. ive already got a bunch of bat jobs, and mole and gopher jobs lined up for next year...

Saw and handled a red bat one time while doing a watch on a golf course country club structure one time.It flew into a electrical line overhead and fell almost on my head. It recovered shortly there after and flew off once again after a good examination by me.

I caught my one and only red bat in a basketball court, hanging from a divider curtain. That bat made the ugliest opossum I ever caught look like Jessica Simpson. I normally like red-heads, but that bat needed plastic surgery. Are they all that ugly?

I think they look like Peter Pan........cute actually.

Mine looked more like Pan's Peter.

Ha!


Jameson, you still doing seal-up above the Mason-Dixon?
It's 50 degrees here and I'm still getting bat calls to do seal up!

Lopez Island for week beginning today.....then eastern WA.........

Oh, to be Dave Vinke and live in the land of milk and money, er, I meant honey.

( Quess that slipped out!)

wow... thats a pretty small house for such a big boom... that would be an easy ladder job..

LOL......BUD........Go Big or Go Home,,,,,,,,,,I like to call it "Smoke and Mirrors".......

Have you ever played on a "wet" 12/12 shake roof???? If you ever get the opportunity to do so,,,,you let me know how it was...

Easy ridge hook ladder setup, no worries there.

Lt.,I have one more bat job scheduled I may start this week. Looks like cooler temps here as well. Will do a attic inspection to see if the bats may still be here or not. Regardless I will make a determination to vent and seal or vent and leave devices in position until spring.

No OSHA??????????
Broken ridge caps??????
Safety ropes hooking under curled shakes??????
Carrying materials to and from area to replace missing or damaged siding?????
Power?????
Safe place to position needed materials??????

You guys work hard...I will work smart..
LOL.....I LUV "OLD School thought"........

safety first of course. broken ridge caps avoided by towels or rubber mating
no safety ropes.. they make an easy fall a swinging tangled up mess.
power- extension cords or cordless tools
safe place to position materials are in tool bag around waist..
my "smoke and mirrors" are all in my salesman ship and my inspection/ bid proposal binder that i hand them a day after the inspection.

Im just messin with you Mr. Vinke.. everyone has their own ways reguardless im sure you did an excellent job!

No worries bud,,,,The comment was directed more at Bob....I thought he would know the value of maintaining the overall appearance of the roof when working on Eastates,,,,
,The moss on the roof is part of the picture painted on the skyline...lol..Foot prints and skid marks are Bad Brush strokes...
,,,,,,Everyone does have their ways,,, and mine ARE the best...LOL.........
A properly designed hook ladder will prevent most ridge damage,,,,And matting under will protect the roof...but not the moss..or my back.
Rope/body harness/spring line are required over 8 feet

I do believe that exposure is a great form of advertising.....
Sure MAYBE,,,,,I could make up the less the 7oo dollars per week by working harder,,,
But can i do a better Job using the right equipment????
Do I look professional?
Can I stand there and saying..."This is Nice" or do I hang on by my toes and drop the piece I need and yell "heads"

I have been self employed in the construction industry since 1982.I have ALWAYS looked for the BEST, EASIEST most cost affective way to perform the task, in a way that benefits myself and the client that I am working for.
Bat exclusion Is finding what tools and materials work best.

When I first started reading these forums most were using Yellow foam,,,,,,,
I have seen pictures of People adhering the end of expandable products like vinyl siding....If you do not know,,,,vinyl is loose "Hung" on the wall to allow in to expand and contract. A 1/4 inch gap is required to allow for this movement,,,,Also..in case you are not aware..the vinyl siding itself is nothing more then a cover to protect the vapor barrier from uv exposure,
The trim molding,,,and the gaps allow for channeling of water threw and out from behind the product
Sure copper mesh has its place,,,just not on my truck

Ron S has shown us some good alternatives to the norm,,,,

Why not install trim Molding??? Metal flashing?? Mortar? Box the eaves and??
Gutter edge flashing?? rake flashing???
I am still learning,,,,because I refuse to Quit looking for a better way........
Got one for tile rake caps????????....

We work as safely and without damage as well as anyone. Never had any damage in using a ridge hook on typical shingle,standing seam or shak roofed homes. We have done several hundred over the years.Most of our hooks are padded as are the rails of the ladder to prevent abrasion.Works very well when needed and practical.I believe we work as smart as the best of them.

Some jobs just dont warrant the use of a lift.That appears to be a newer good shape log home and with reasonable access using conventional equipment.All the bells and whistles are all well and good if practical but if not I dont add the addtional cost needed for a rental unless really necessary.

Nothing wrong with that approach particularly if the customer doesnt mind the additional cost.

awesome!! again personal preference on ways of work... are your calls slowing down??

Great points. Sometimes "getting by" with ladders allows the project to be affordable for the customer... but safety is not always inexpensive.

The advertising gained through lift usage in residential areas is priceless. I often use mine on structures that could be done in about the same time period using ladders, but then I just look like some painter, fix-it man, or gutter cleaner. The lift gets second looks, and always initiates conversation with people passing by, whether walking their dogs or driving their vehicle.

I would much prefer doing any 2-story structure with the lift, as I can simply park in the middle of each side and do the entire side, ground to highest peak or chimney. Both hands free for working, tools and materials in the bucket or basket.

This particular home was in a very elite neighborhood in Springfield, IL. It had a slate roof, and it was much easier (and eliminated damage concerns) by using the lift.... PLUS I got 2 more bat jobs in the area from people who "noticed" the lift and stopped by to talk after then reading the truck lettering. Also got a deck screening job across the street... the lady thought I looked like I run a "good business" since I have the right equipment for each job.

In business, image is very important. I've watched competitors throw things up to guys on ladders or rooftops, and the homeowners are cringing at the sight. However, image is not going to keep you in business if you don't have the work ethic to match.

Found a Great tool by Accident for installing "Most" stuff-it type materials.

The bird spike Installation tool from Nixalite.....

Ron i couldnt agree with you more. Maybe this coming year ill pick up a towable boom lift. i agree with the exposure and conversation piece. thanks for sharing.

Ditto!

LT you are so close to your 10k mark in posts... lol what a hobby

and he says he works so hard.MMMMMMMMmmm Real trappers, lure makers and ADC men dont have alot of pc time......... cause we are always doing something.Like now, I am working my evening shift packing orders until 11 or 12 pm.:)

One hour a day devoted to Trapperman there, Bobby J.

...and "a lot" is two words!

Besides that, it's been raining non-stop for two days straight!

10,000 post? Well hopefully I helped someone with at least one of those I added to or started...and if I did, well, I did my job.
Sharing info is the sole reason I'm on here...If that bothers people, that I have too much free time, so be it.

You see, I can afford to have a LapTop in my vehicle....and if I want to visit Trapperman when I have some free time, that's exactlly what I'm going to do.
I don't have to work anymore 7 days a week.
Everything I have is payed for!

House and both business' are paid and owned. Just have the truck left that I have to buy every 3-4 yrs.

congrats guys on having successful business's im just starting off and everything is paid for except my house. 8 more years til thats paid off.

LOL.......You OLD guys have it made.....

Driving Cadillac and Mercadies......

Me.....I'm just "lucky" that there is still some building going on .....so I can get the "Free" refrigerator boxes for Room Additions and Roof repairs!!......

LT says everything he has is paid for....he must be single

Vinke, I'm with you. My wife got a brand new washer and a brand new dryer. I got the boxes. (but they are comfortable)

Yes Paul, as a matter of fact I am.....and for the record, regrettably!
Good quality women are hard to find....out there, but I only need ONE BGOOD one!